Bank of Ireland tracker mortgage % increase

in Mortgages & Endowments
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  • JimmyTheWigJimmyTheWig Forumite
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    cs1800 wrote: »
    I was not supplied with a copy of the Residential agreement at the time, I have asked BOI to supply me with a copy to see what this clause says. I am starting to believe it is no more that a 2 line cause and as it was to fundamental to the agreement I am amazed B&W did not include it in the text of my T&C
    The thing is, at the time this _wasn't_ particularly fundamental to the agreement. As Thrug says:
    Thrugelmir wrote: »
    No one forecast base rate to be so low for so long.
    What has happened to the base rate has been completely and utterly unprecidented.
    This wasn't a clause that they deliberately kept hidden away with a view to spring it on people when they least expect it. It wasn't some Order 66. They honestly thought that they would never need to use it, so they didn't make a big deal about it.
    I am also starting to wonder why BOI didnt quote it in the letter telling me the differential was going up - you would have thought if there was justification in the cause they would have been more than happy to quote it, but we will have to see what they come back with.
    I agree with this, however. It does seem a little odd that the clause is so hard to find.
    I would find it hard to believe that they would have done this on the basis of the clause not being watertight (they must have expected people to be unhappy about it!) but probably worth someone looking in to.
  • JimmyTheWigJimmyTheWig Forumite
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    Beej_1973 wrote: »
    Yes, because I would have picked another mortgage linked to the Bank of England base rate. At that timethere were loads around, strangely you cant find one now
    I believe that it was claimed, towards the start of this whole discussion, that the clause was industry standard.
    Customers have rightly said that, not being mortgage industry experts, that wouldn't have helped them know about it.
    But it does mean that the chances are the other trackers around at the time would have had the same clause.

    I think that it is worth looking in to as to whether that was the case or not, but if that is the case then I don't think that you would be able to claim that had you known about the clause you would have picked bank X (who haven't (yet) changed their differential) over BoI because of this clause that they both had.
    If you do find a mortgage was available at the time without such a clause then you may be able to claim that you would have chosen that one had you known. But you would need a fairly convincing argument that you would have found this clause important. Given that no-one in the industry (e.g. your mortgage advisor) would have said there was any realistic prospect of a bank using the clause, do you honestly think you would have picked the more expensive (at the time) mortgage because of it? And do you think that you'd be able to convince someone (e.g. ombudsman) of that?
  • BR_LandlordBR_Landlord Forumite
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    Quote from another forum (I hope thats ok)
    "Bank Of Ireland published their Preliminary Statement on 4 Mar 13. It shows they made an operating profit, meet the capital requirements and they say they don’t expect to need to raise further capital when the new stress tests are made later this year ( having raised new capital autumn 2012). Interest margins improved from 1.25% to 1.34% in last half of 2012. Fairly upbeat about future. In other words not consistent with the letter of 25 Feb and there does not seem to be much justification to invoke the alleged special condition."
    ??
  • kingstreetkingstreet Forumite
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    There may be similar clauses in other lenders' documentation, the difference is they are trading lenders trying to attract new business and applying unfavourable terms may affect that.

    BoI no longer transacts business in the UK. It therefore believes it can act with relative impunity as it doesn't really care. It can upset existing customers as it wants rid of them anyway and it has no interest in new borrowers.

    BoI UK is a separate business and it hides behind its Post Office marketing brand, so the name-link has little impact on it.
    I am a mortgage broker. You should note that this site doesn't check my status as a Mortgage Adviser, so you need to take my word for it. This signature is here as I follow MSE's Mortgage Adviser Code of Conduct. Any posts on here are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as financial advice. Please do not send PMs asking for one-to-one-advice, or representation.
  • [QUOTE I agree with this, however. It does seem a little odd that the clause is so hard to find.
    I would find it hard to believe that they would have done this on the basis of the clause not being watertight (they must have expected people to be unhappy about it!) but probably worth someone looking in to.[/QUOTE]
    It would be more convincing had they quoted the clause in the recent letter/8pp leaflet. In not stating the reason it has made it difficult to know what to argue (with them) about. The trouble with this tactic is a) lenders are not so gullible not to notice the evasion and b) the internet has provided the ability to exchange information.
    It is easier to fob people off if they are not joined up. Unfortunately we have no guarantees they wont raise their rate as BofE rises, although I would like to trust them not to act in this way.
  • kingstreet wrote: »
    There may be similar clauses in other lenders' documentation, the difference is they are trading lenders trying to attract new business and applying unfavourable terms may affect that.

    BoI no longer transacts business in the UK. It therefore believes it can act with relative impunity as it doesn't really care. It can upset existing customers as it wants rid of them anyway and it has no interest in new borrowers.

    BoI UK is a separate business and it hides behind its Post Office marketing brand, so the name-link has little impact on it.

    I think you are absolutely right.
  • smiffysmiffy Forumite
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    I've read the some of the BTL customers were offer up to £8500 to move their mortgage account previously.

    As a residential customer, some time ago we received a call (twice) from BOI trying to encourage us to switch to HSBC product.

    They said they were trying to reduce their mortgage base, and were prepared to pay the £995 fee that the HSBC product attracted. I don't recall the exact details, but the HSBC product was at a higher rate than I was paying, so had no interest in switching - after all I have a "rate for term" product.

    Does anyone remember receiving these calls too?

    Did anyone actually switch?
  • Why doesn't everyone form a group which collectively notifies BoI that they will all stop their direct debit mortgage payments from the date of the rate increase? Could the BoI cope with the volume of legal processes that would entail bringing to each and every individual?
  • GMSGMS Forumite
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    Adamski1 wrote: »
    Why doesn't everyone form a group which collectively notifies BoI that they will all stop their direct debit mortgage payments from the date of the rate increase? Could the BoI cope with the volume of legal processes that would entail bringing to each and every individual?

    Missed mortgage payments would destroy individuals credit files and make it nigh on impossible to refinance elsewhere. Repssession would be the ultimate ending.

    High price to pay for proving a point.
    I am a Mortgage Adviser
    You should note that this site doesn't check my status as a mortgage adviser, so you need to take my word for it. This signature is here as I follow MSE's Mortgage Adviser Code of Conduct. Any posts on here are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as financial advice.
  • HobbyHobby Forumite
    28 Posts
    It appears that many customers , me included , never received the Residential Mortgage Conditions , with the original BTL loan offer and it it these conditions that the BOI are now using to shaft us all. Please can you all contact your local MP and also copy in Andrew Tyrie MP who is the Chairman of the Banking Standards Commission. The more contact his researcher gets the more likely it will be mentioned at the treasury. Don't forget to also tell the FSA and the BOI you never received the Residential Mortgage Conditions with the offer. The more customers that state this fact , the more it confirms each others account.

    The fact that the Residential Mortgage Conditions were never supplied , albeit there is a clause making reference to them in the offer , is likely to be of critical importance at any legal hearings.
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