slow drivers

Gilbert2

pka wrote: »

If, as I suspect the reason for most people doing it is option 1, then I don't believe they are being inconsiderate. I would much rather they drove at a speed they feel safe at, than push their boundaries by going faster to 'keep other road users happy'.

But this simply translates as actually being inconsiderate.

You would rather they drive slow to feel safe (?), rather than keep other road users happy ( ie not considering them).

Pretty selfish attitude and a serious question mark over their fitness to hold a licence.

brat

martinthebandit wrote: »

So after passing your yet you decided to forget what you had learnt and drive how you like.

I had 16 years between my first test and my next test, and I had forgotten a few things. In the 23 years since that second test, I've been tested 11 times, and had 18 weeks of intense driver training and tactical instruction.
I think you're getting confused by thinking that I actually practice the type of driving that I'm suggesting is not inconsiderately slow. I don't, but I don't worry about those who do.

martinthebandit wrote: »

Oh and just out of curiosity care to point me in the right direction so I can see who it is that is constantly telling you these things please.

DirectGov wrote:

The national speed limit is not a target speed.

RoSPA wrote:

Remember, speed limits are a maximum, not a target

TheAA wrote:

the faster you go the greater the fuel consumption and pollution

It's a start I guess, there is so much advice out there from generally accepted sources...

If an elderly driver feels safer doing 40-45 mph than 60mph on an A road, I'd rather they were doing that, than feel pressurised to drive outside their comfort zone.

To argue that they should have their keys thrown away is shameful, when their driving style can easily be accommodated with a little tolerance and understanding.

I really can't understand why you get irked by the older driver, and seemingly not by the HGV which cannot legally do any more than 40mph on these roads. On the A roads I patrol the HGVs are probably 20 times more prevalent than Mrs Miggins doing 40 in her Micra, and are more of an obstacle to pass. Perhaps you could explain your thoughts to me?

pka_2

Gilbert2 wrote: »

But this simply translates as actually being inconsiderate.

You would rather they drive slow to feel safe (?), rather than keep other road users happy ( ie not considering them).

Pretty selfish attitude and a serious question mark over their fitness to hold a licence.

Yes if it means they're not going to crash.... that would inconvenience me a lot more.

Gilbert2

brat wrote: »

. On the A roads I patrol

Here we go again! Walter bluddy Mitty.

Gilbert2

pka wrote: »

Yes if it means they're not going to crash.... that would inconvenience me a lot more.

And it would inconvenience you even less, to zero, if they were not on the road in the first place, which they shouldn't be if they are unable to drive close to whatever the signed limit is.

If they can't do something as basic as that then God help us should they need to quickly react to a child running out in the road!

steve-L

brat wrote: »

I really can't understand why you get irked by the older driver, and seemingly not by the HGV which cannot legally do any more than 40mph on these roads. On the A roads I patrol the HGVs are probably 20 times more prevalent than Mrs Miggins doing 40 in her Micra, and are more of an obstacle to pass. Perhaps you could explain your thoughts to me?

Your probably not asking me but I can answer that for me.
Most of the time the HGV driver will let other's pass when he or she gets to a place they can let you past.

Most of the time Mrs. Miggins will simply drift in and out of the white line meaning you can't overtake because she doesn't even know you (or the other 30 cars) are behind her or if she does doesn't care.

Its the same on sliproads, overtaking on motorways etc.
The majority (obviously not all) HGV drivers tend to let people out, flash you back in and act considerately.
What they don't do is say "Its only safe/legal for me to do 40 so YOU should do 40 as well"

HGV drivers coming to 30 limit in the village usually then slow to 30 or even 20 in the villiage, Mrs Miggins seems to just continue at 40 regardless of the fact its a 30 limit and regardless of the fact the person/people behind that thought it safe to do 60 in the NSL now think its safe to do 20!

brat

steve-L wrote: »

It seems we substantially agree ......
My take is if 45 is their 85th %ile then if its a long long stretch of single lane NSL with no safe passing places they can make some effort into their 90th%ile. The biggest issue is they need to recognise that this 85th %ile is THEM.... they are not the police and courts to decide that 'this road is safe at 45 mph and anyone wanting to go faster in the NSL is going too quickly'.

I don't think they feel they're policing the road. Not at all. Their choice of speed is their choice and they will have no desire to influence or encourage other road users to drive to their speed. If you're saying that the slow elderly driver is pulling out to prevent drivers overtaking, then I'd have to accept that's inconsiderate, but you're bringing a whole new set of situations to the debate, that I, and I presume many others don't recognise.

We as society might feel that their experience and age demand some respect and let them keep driving even though they would fail a test.

Most drivers on the road would fail a basic driving test tomorrow. A driving test is a test to show the ability to learn basic competencies to allow them a licence to drive on the road. It is not the plimsoll line for careless/ inconsiderate. that's a completely different line in the sand. No elderly driver is likely to have sat a driving test where they were required to do more than 30mph. We could argue that's wrong, but it's not their fault.

Compare this to the boy racer who fails the test for over confidence and lack of experience. The boy/girl-racer can actually improve, learn etc. and by re-taking their test improve but the person with diminished faculties is not going to improve.... making them re-sit their test will just show they have not got the faculties.

Big issues I agree.

My other issue is that a fair percent of them are all round terrible drivers. They may be doing 45 round a bend and then brake in the actual bend. If they are driving a Jag with 10J wheels that's all well and good for them but its not so good for the guy or gal behind in the HGV or Corsa who by braking in the corner to keep a safe distance pushes the envelope of their safety.

As I've said it's subjective. you're now introducing more driver inability into the equation, which would become part of the careless/inconsiderate consideration. A case in Scotland was prosecuted for careless where an elderly driver was convicted of careless driving by doing the stuff you describe. Here

The same drivers often seem blissfully unaware they have developed a long queue behind them who must now all shuffle and brake to maintain a safe distance.

That's their reponsibility. They generally seem to manage fine behind a 40mph HGV, or a 20mph tractor. What mechanism and tactic does the 40mph elderly driver adopt to make themselves much more dangerous than the HGV driving at his legal max speed?

In the same way they then get to a town on the same road and continue at 40mph.... where I with my presumably in place faculties might need to drive at 20....

I have heard this anecdote much more often than I have experienced it.

brat

steve-L wrote: »

Your probably not asking me but I can answer that for me.
Most of the time the HGV driver will let other's pass when he or she gets to a place they can let you past.

Most of the time Mrs. Miggins will simply drift in and out of the white line meaning you can't overtake because she doesn't even know you (or the other 30 cars) are behind her or if she does doesn't care.

Its the same on sliproads, overtaking on motorways etc.
The majority (obviously not all) HGV drivers tend to let people out, flash you back in and act considerately.
What they don't do is say "Its only safe/legal for me to do 40 so YOU should do 40 as well"

HGV drivers coming to 30 limit in the village usually then slow to 30 or even 20 in the villiage, Mrs Miggins seems to just continue at 40 regardless of the fact its a 30 limit and regardless of the fact the person/people behind that thought it safe to do 60 in the NSL now think its safe to do 20!

As I already said, you seem to be creating a whole new set of prejudices that have no part in the original concept - which was the concern over drivers who do 45 ish on an A road - nothing to do with old drivers wandering out of lane. ( although as an aside I'm sure I see many more HGVs go out of lane than elderly car drivers - especially on the motorway)

Gilbert2

brat wrote: »

I don't think they feel they're policing the road. Not at all. Their choice of speed is their choice and they will have no desire to influence or encourage other road users to drive to their speed. .

But it isn't, is it?

Why do you continue to ignore this?

If a motorist chooses to drive unnecessarily slowly then they could be booked for it.

Just as if someone chooses to speed over a limit.

Both can be offences yet, for one of them, you seemingly encourage!

You need to explain this anomaly.

Gilbert2

brat wrote: »

I don't think they feel they're policing the road. Not at all. Their choice of speed is their choice and they will have no desire to influence or encourage other road users to drive to their speed. .

Of course they do!

I live rural and there is one particular road that is 10 miles long before reaching a roundabout either end.

At busy periods, one may have just a handful of opportunities to overtake, sometimes none at all.

I know, I use it daily.

And very often I have the misfortune to be stuck behind Mrs Muggins who is driving at 40 when the whole length is 60 mph.

Perfect driving conditions, no reason whatsoever to drive like that and all of us in a congo behind being dictated to by her!

I've even seen these idiots blissfully unaware of an emergency vehicle behind with lights flashing & sirens blaring.

They are a menace on the road just like a speeder and you won't admit it.