MSE News: MPs vote to limit benefit rises to 1%

plum2002

zoominatorone wrote: »

perhaps you could clarify what you are talking about?

Kids growing up and working after watching their mothers on benefit all their lives will be rarer than hen's teeth. Too many single parents see being on benefits as a career choice and have never ever worked, and never ever want to.

I know plenty of single parents, we all work, our teenagers have newspaper rounds at 13, shelf stack in supermarkets or wait tables from 16 onwards and study, just the same as I did. Not one of my friends claims tc's, some do get CB though, however we all kept working and have never claimed income support. Not all single parents are as you paint them.

Morlock

zoominatorone wrote: »

Too many single parents see being on benefits as a career choice and have never ever worked, and never ever want to.

Except that the majority of single parents do work, 'too many' in your above sentence equates to a small minority, if any.

clemmatis

Morlock wrote: »

The point was that the majority of people will pay in far less than the amount they receive in related benefits over a lifetime.

The CPS says that it is true that the majority pay less in taxes than they receive in state benefits/tax credits, and for example state education and the NHS.

princessdon

Morlock wrote: »

I included housing benefit as OAPs are the largest percentage of housing benefit recipients, so it seemed relevant. I neglected to include free prescriptions, free travel, heating allowance, attendance allowance, council tax benefit, disability living allowance, free dental care, NHS care etc.

The point was that the majority of people will pay in far less than the amount they receive in related benefits over a lifetime.

I think that depends on many things mainly personal perspective. I don't know anyone on benefits (bar a waste of space who gives claimants a bad name). That's not being untruthful its based on my life. I live in an owner occupier area, all my friends and family work and own their homes. Average salary of friends is circa £50k as we all lost cb.

Someone living in a predominently social housing particularly with high enemployment would hold a different view.

The majority who I know will pay far more in taxes.

If this wasn't the case the country would be worse than it is.

princessdon

plum2002 wrote: »

I know plenty of single parents, we all work, our teenagers have newspaper rounds at 13, shelf stack in supermarkets or wait tables from 16 onwards and study, just the same as I did. Not one of my friends claims tc's, some do get CB though, however we all kept working and have never claimed income support. Not all single parents are as you paint them.

Very true, however, there are many who do fit the stereotype and its generally the case they have the larger number of children.

Does anyone know the statistics of lone parents who claim zero benefits? I'd think they were the minority overall.

Morlock

princessdon wrote: »

I think that depends on many things mainly personal perspective. I don't know anyone on benefits (bar a waste of space who gives claimants a bad name).

Being 'on benefits' and 'related benefits of tax contributions' are two separate issues. I doubt many taxpayers never use the NHS, police, fire service, roads, libraries, swimming pools etc. These are the related benefits of paying tax, of which, most taxpayers will reap disproportionate benefits.

princessdon wrote: »

The majority who I know will pay far more in taxes.

I doubt that very much. But even so, you are referring to a minority who pay high taxes, not the majority.

princessdon

Morlock wrote: »

Being 'on benefits' and 'related benefits of tax contributions' are two separate issues. I doubt many taxpayers never use the NHS, police, fire service, roads, libraries, swimming pools etc. These are the related benefits of paying tax, of which, most taxpayers will reap disproportionate benefits.



I doubt that very much. But even so, you are referring to a minority who pay high taxes, not the majority.

Are most of those not funded via council tax? Again which owner occupies pay a higher value. You were saying benefit cost including hb in your original post, that is what I refer to.

I think I once saw a calculator on DT that took salary, number of children and average reliance on NHS, and calculated estimated net reliance, may see if I can find it. You also need to remember that indirect taxation VAT is higher again for those with disposable incomes that are high.

Example - my household has paid far more in tax, ni than your link up there and we have 30 years or so expectation to work.

Morlock

princessdon wrote: »

Very true, however, there are many who do fit the stereotype and its generally the case they have the larger number of children.

Given that the average age of a single parent is 38, the majority work, and the number of single parents having three or more children has declined over the last decade, who are these 'many' benefit career single mothers popping out kid after to kid to maximise benefits?

The facts do not support the anecdote. If the anecdote has a shred of truth, then the stereotype is a small minority.

princessdon wrote: »

Does anyone know the statistics of lone parents who claim zero benefits? I'd think they were the minority overall.

I suspect they are a minority as not many single parents earn over £50,000 per annum, the majority of taxpayers don't either.

princessdon

Morlock wrote: »

Given that the average age of a single parent is 38, the majority work, and the number of single parents having three or more children has declined over the last decade, who are these 'many' benefit career single mothers popping out kid after to kid to maximise benefits?

The facts do not support the anecdote. If the anecdote has a shred of truth, then the stereotype is a small minority.



I suspect they are a minority as not many single parents earn over £50,000 per annum, the majority of taxpayers don't either.

Are you denying they exist? I wouldn't have been employed for the last 10 years if they didn't. Therefore the facts do support the anecdote that they will be claiming benefits.

Removing child benefit from the equation there will still not be many lone parents with school age children who don't claim hb and or tax credits. I certainly don't think they should be stigmatised as many are as hardworking as myself but due to single income and childcare they are more likely to claim benefits than a couple who have better childcare options and or dual incomes.

Morlock

princessdon wrote: »

Are you denying they exist? I wouldn't have been employed for the last 10 years if they didn't. Therefore the facts do support the anecdote that they will be claiming benefits.

The anecdote wasn't that single parents claim benefits, the anecdote was:

zoominatorone wrote: »

Too many single parents see being on benefits as a career choice and have never ever worked, and never ever want to.

The facts prove that if the above stereotype exists, it is a very small minority, which is not really conducive with the phrase 'too many'.