DVLA threatening to fine me.

Road_Hog

Joe_Horner wrote: »

DVLA do NOT issue fines, they issue "penalties".

But do they?

They went after me after I didn't renew a SORN declaration - what a stupid idea, you tell them the car is off-road and they expect you to keep telling the the same thing each year. Quite frankly, if you sign a SORN it is off-road until you tell them otherwise.

Anyhow, they had some private third party company send me some semi-legal document saying I was fined. So I sent it back - no contract - bog off. I had one reminder and that was it.

TrickyWicky

Rover_Driver wrote: »

Not quite the same, the matters dealt with by the DVLA are contrary to the Vehicles Excise & Registration Act 1994.

The Late Licensing Penalty is section 7A.

While I do think Joe is wrong in the way that some of the terminology is slightly wrong, he is correct in that the DVLA do not have the power to act as Judge, Jury and Executioner - especially without any right of appeal which councils must offer with their PCNs.

DVLA can't prove you never posted documents to them and they cannot prove an accusation of perjury so they are in essence stuffed.

Rover_Driver

TrickyWicky wrote: »

he is correct in that the DVLA do not have the power to act as Judge, Jury and Executioner - especially without any right of appeal which councils must offer with their PCNs.

It's no different to any debt that is in dispute, the claimant can make an application to the County Court for payment of the debt to be enforced, the court then decide if the claim is valid or not.

Convincing the court that the claim is valid is another matter though................

paddedjohn

Well I posted the letter as in post 3 and have now received request of £80 for a late licencing penalty, reduced to £40 if I pay by the 15th. They are saying that this is because I didn't inform them of the sale of the van and it is up to me to inform them that I haven't received an acknowledgement letter within 20 working days of notification. Is it best to pay the £40 and then fight to get it back or ignore their claims and carry on to court eventually? What are the repercussions of taking this all the way to court?

redux

paddedjohn wrote: »

Well I posted the letter as in post 3 and have now received request of £80 for a late licencing penalty, reduced to £40 if I pay by the 15th. They are saying that this is because I didn't inform them of the sale of the van and it is up to me to inform them that I haven't received an acknowledgement letter within 20 working days of notification. Is it best to pay the £40 and then fight to get it back or ignore their claims and carry on to court eventually? What are the repercussions of taking this all the way to court?

Interesting.

My old car is still registered in my name at an address I left 10 and half years ago.

They never updated my address or sent me a new registration document when I told them I'd moved

Six months after moving I bought my current car and declared the other SORN, and kept it on the drive for a year and a bit before eventually having a scrapyard collect it while I was away abroad. I think the dealer collecting it gave my parents a receipt, but it was handwritten with only very paltry details on it.

18 months or so later I got a letter forwarded to me from the people at the old house, which was from somewhere in Kent trying to collect a fine or penalty charge from me for not taxing it or declaring SORN the following year.

I phoned a woman there and she said she would sort it all out, and don't worry about the fine.

I also wrote to the DVLA again about both the change of address and parting with the vehicle.

Since then I've phoned or written about 5 or 6 times, and as I say it's still registered at the 10 years old address about 8 or 9 years after it would have been scrapped

There may have been other letters to me at the old address, no longer forwarded

Perhaps this is why the last time I phoned the DVLA a couple of months ago they made veiled suggestions about me being obliged to contact not only them about the change of address but also their enforcement team, which might be in Oxfordshire or Northants by now ...

I just wish they would accept something I've told them about 10 times altogether, but after reading some of this I'm worried afresh about a possible queue of fines and interest waiting to meet me somewhere ...

Doing some searches, I can see about 6 of my other old cars still on file, including back in 1985 (built in 1970) and 1991 (built 1978 exported 1991, using the correct forms), but I can't imagine they can pursue me about those as SORN hadn't been invented by then

paddedjohn

Just bumping this up rather than start new thread

peter_the_piper

May I suggest that you also post this on pepipoo.com. There is some regulation which the police use to say that if a letter is despatched its presumed delivered. This applies also to the dvla but I do not remembe the exact title, someone on there will be able to enlighten you.

paddedjohn

Is that "the interpretations act 1978"? I found that and that is what my defence is but was wondering what the worst case scenario would be if I took it all the way to court and lost.

Wig

I guess worst case scenario would be you lose the court case, you owe them £80 plus court costs, which could be a total of £230 ?

I doubt you would lose, the wording of the law is quite clear, and it is this law that government agencies would use to fine you, if it were the other way around..... an NIP for speeding for example.

Paradigm

paddedjohn wrote: »

They are saying that this is because I didn't inform them of the sale of the van and it is up to me to inform them that I haven't received an acknowledgement letter within 20 working days of notification. Is it best to pay the £40 and then fight to get it back or ignore their claims and carry on to court eventually? What are the repercussions of taking this all the way to court?

You have no legal obligation to contact them, this is something the DVLA has added itself. There is nothing in law requiring it.

I would simply send a letter stating that the van was sold to xxxxx on xxxx date & the correctly filled in V5 was posted to them as required by road vehicles (registration & licencing) regulations 2002 & you have therefore fulfilled your legal obligation. You can include the Interpretations act too.

As for it going to court, I doubt it will if all they're relying on is "you should have contacted us if you didn't get a letter"....

See here for a similar case http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?249629