Mobile Phone Micropayments

ThumbRemote

MamaMoo wrote: »

There are plenty of ways to monitor Internet history. Keystroke loggers/screenshot programmes, delete the private browsing option from the browser etc, or just tell your child they will be punished if they delete their history.

If a parent will not take appropriate measures to safeguard browsing, then they should not let their child on the Internet. Simple.

Look, really, you've taken every opportunity in every post to berate the OP. It's boring now, we all get your point. The OP could have done more to prevent this, their son is at fault, they haven't disputed this.

You seem more bothered with pointing out to the OP how much better you are than them, how this would have never happened to you, etc, etc. Which is all great until you make a mistake.

dalesrider

MamaMoo wrote: »

it's no easier, really, than stealing a debit card and topping your phone up by however much. In this situation, also, the OP could not claim the money back via her bank as she would be deemed to be negligent with her card.!

Well as someone who deals with fraud. If the card holder says its not them and its a CNP (card not present) transaction. Then it has to be treated as fraud and the customer refunded.
The only time it would be rejected is if it kept happening.
In the case of mobile phone top ups this will result in the mobile being blocked by the mobile co when the bank claims the money back.

In a previous post I ask as the the type of phone used. As Apple, and this covers the whole apple range. have in their wisdom allowed app creators to charge within the apps. Now this can be turned off.
But it is seriously hard to find this setting and it is set at ON as default.
So any child can ask mum & dad to download a FREE game. But then within the game run up massive bills via purchasing things to continue game play.
Clearly this is a major flaw in the Apple system and Apple are fully aware of it. So much so that when a customer calls about Apple trans they are questioned about familiy access to games. If it is thought that this is the case they are directed to Apple about this and ALL seem to be getting refunds from Apple.
There is also the sad case that parental controls only kick in after 15 mins....

Do a search for apple in app purchase settings (turn off is no 6)
In app pricing is also documented by apple here So app creators can add it very easily.

How to turn off...

1. Turn on your Apple product. From the home screen tap the Settings app. Inside Settings tap “General.”
2. About halfway down the page you should see the label “Restrictions”. Tap the “Enable Restrictions” button.
3. Once the enable button has been tapped, you’ll be asked to set a passcode. It’s basically a numeric password locks certain functions on your iOS device. Make sure that the passcode is something that you’ll remember. Remember not to share it with people you don’t want making purchases on your product. Enter the passcode twice to set it.
4. Now that you have a passcode, scroll down to the “Allowed Content” section.
5. Slide the in-app purchases slider to Off. By doing this you will prevent people who don’t know the passcode from making in-app purchases.


Read more: http://www.digitaltrends.com/how-to/how-to-turn-off-in-app-purchases-on-apple-products/#ixzz2FQdwXoth
Follow us: @digitaltrends on Twitter | digitaltrendsftw on Facebook

melbell

So you got your son a contract in your name, He ran up a bill and now you want either the game operator or mobile phone operator to loose out because of YOUR negligence.

Really, pay it and suck it up to experience, get your son on giffgaff who actively block this sort of thing.

MamaMoo_2

dalesrider wrote: »

Well as someone who deals with fraud. If the card holder says its not them and its a CNP (card not present) transaction. Then it has to be treated as fraud and the customer refunded.
The only time it would be rejected is if it kept happening.
In the case of mobile phone top ups this will result in the mobile being blocked by the mobile co when the bank claims the money back.

In a previous post I ask as the the type of phone used. As Apple, and this covers the whole apple range. have in their wisdom allowed app creators to charge within the apps. Now this can be turned off.
But it is seriously hard to find this setting and it is set at ON as default.
So any child can ask mum & dad to download a FREE game. But then within the game run up massive bills via purchasing things to continue game play.
Clearly this is a major flaw in the Apple system and Apple are fully aware of it. So much so that when a customer calls about Apple trans they are questioned about familiy access to games. If it is thought that this is the case they are directed to Apple about this and ALL seem to be getting refunds from Apple.
There is also the sad case that parental controls only kick in after 15 mins....

Do a search for apple in app purchase settings (turn off is no 6)
In app pricing is also documented by apple here So app creators can add it very easily.

How to turn off...

Firstly, I have active experience of a family member who had her card used by her daughter. As the fraud was by a family member at the same address the bank (Barclays iirc) refused to refund citing gross negligence. This was appealed as high as the FO and Barclays decision was upheld.

I have an iPhone, and when I allow my son to play games (I turn airplane mode on so he can't call or text accidentally) in-app purchases are turned off. This feature issomething I was made aware of by Phones4U. Also, when I am using apps, and I wish to make an in-app purchase, I am always asked for my Apple ID and password to verify the purchase. Obviously, not owning every app in existence I can't say whether this is the case for every app, but all the ones I have used have used this system. There seems to be no way to bypass it with the games I use.
Again, if in-app purchases are made without authorisation, then it's not Apple's fault or the network providers fault, it is the person making said purchases, and the person who owns the phone's fault for not putting readily available measures in place to stop this!
People shouldn't blame everyone else for their naïvet!, ignorance, or laziness!

MamaMoo_2

ThumbRemote wrote: »

Look, really, you've taken every opportunity in every post to berate the OP. It's boring now, we all get your point. The OP could have done more to prevent this, their son is at fault, they haven't disputed this.

You seem more bothered with pointing out to the OP how much better you are than them, how this would have never happened to you, etc, etc. Which is all great until you make a mistake.

Not at all, I make many mistakes. I take ownership for them. I'm not any better than the OP, I just wish people would face the consequences of their actions rather than looking for a way to place the blame on everyone else!

dalesrider

MamaMoo wrote: »

Again, if in-app purchases are made without authorisation, then it's not Apple's fault or the network providers fault, it is the person making said purchases, and the person who owns the phone's fault for not putting readily available measures in place to stop this!
People shouldn't blame everyone else for their naïvet!, ignorance, or laziness!

So you think that Apple is right to allow games that are designed for under 9's to have in app purchase?
Sadly anyone under 10 cannot be charged by the authorities.... Wonder if this is why Apple roll over so easily as if someone really took task Apple would be forced to pull this feature that makes them £££ for no work.

Remember NOT EVERYONE is clearly as clued up as you are.

For Apple not to shoulder some of the blame. The only apps that allow in app purchases are for over 18's.

dalesrider

MamaMoo wrote: »

Firstly, I have active experience of a family member who had her card used by her daughter. As the fraud was by a family member at the same address the bank (Barclays iirc) refused to refund citing gross negligence. This was appealed as high as the FO and Barclays decision was upheld.!

Clearly that person was not prepared to take it to the police or take ownership of them.....

Wonder how Barclays found out it was to the same address? Clearly the retailer provided details.

MamaMoo_2

dalesrider wrote: »

Clearly that person was not prepared to take it to the police or take ownership of them.....

Wonder how Barclays found out it was to the same address? Clearly the retailer provided details.

When the bank informed her of the name and address used, she sat her daughter down and got her to own up. She then gave her daughter one month to pay up or be taken to court. She paid up.

MamaMoo_2

dalesrider wrote: »

So you think that Apple is right to allow games that are designed for under 9's to have in app purchase?
Sadly anyone under 10 cannot be charged by the authorities.... Wonder if this is why Apple roll over so easily as if someone really took task Apple would be forced to pull this feature that makes them £££ for no work.

Remember NOT EVERYONE is clearly as clued up as you are.

For Apple not to shoulder some of the blame. The only apps that allow in app purchases are for over 18's.

Don't all in-app purchases require a password?

salen40

youngsolicitor wrote: »

Jagex never got past the bar in the first place because your son didn't have authority to make the purchase. My understanding is that the bar only applies to purchases in an app rather than purchases by text message so I'm not sure if this particular bit helps.

The legal analysis goes something like this. When your money is used by someone who doesn't have authority to use that money (e.g. your son), you are entitled to get that money back from third parties (e.g. Jagex) under the law of restitution and unjust enrichment.

There are some defences to restitutionary claims. Another poster gave the example of a thief who bought something from a local shop. The shop could claim the defence called "bona fide purchaser" which applies where you hand over something tangible and don't know that the person didn't have authority to make the transaction.

However, Jagex cannot claim this defence because they didn't hand over anything tangible. Unlike the shopkeeper they are not in a worse position due to the transaction. Runescape credits do not have a real value and can simply be removed from your son's account. Therefore I think Jagex are legally obliged to refund the money.

If they refunded the money then Jagex would have a theoretical claim against your son for pretending that he had authority to make the transaction when he did not, but realistically Jagex are never going to bring a claim like that.

Thank you for such a useful insight and for not slaughtering me as a negligent and lazy parent who does not keep an eye on what her son does 24 hours a day. I will continue to pursue this as the bottom line still lies with your original point that all this was unauthorised.