A Seasonal Warning for Pet Owners

System

I see you've only bolded the 10 pounds comment when the gist of his post was a small piece of chocolate isn't enough to kill a dog.

None of the weights you've quoted would really be classed as a "small piece of chocolate" although they are obviously a lot less than 10lbs

shaun_from_Africa

I know a small piece isn't enough to kill a dog (unless it's a very small dog), but a small amount of dark chocolate can still make a dog ill.

The figures given on both the Nat Geo site and in the vets manual show that as little as 1.5oz of dark chocolate can cause vomiting and diarrhea in a 10KG dog and it may only take 4.5 ounces to cause seizures in the dog and less than 8oz to kill it.

An 8oz bar of chocolate isn't very big, and if someone is giving their dog small pieces every now and again, it might not take too long before a dangerous level is reached.

I see you've only bolded the 10 pounds comment when the gist of his post was a small piece of chocolate isn't enough to kill a dog.

Not quite. I actually bolded two bits of text, the 2nd one being:

If you want to educate people, at least do it right and with some perspective.

System

shaun_from_Africa wrote: »

I know a small piece isn't enough to kill a dog (unless it's a very small dog), but a small amount of dark chocolate can still make a dog ill.

The figures given on both the Nat Geo site and in the vets manual show that as little as 1.5oz of dark chocolate can cause vomiting and diarrhea in a 10KG dog and it may only take 4.5 ounces to cause seizures in the dog and less than 8oz to kill it.

An 8oz bar of chocolate isn't very big, and if someone is giving their dog small pieces every now and again, it might not take too long before a dangerous level is reached.


Not quite. I actually bolded two bits of text, the 2nd one being:

The second bold statement is right. There was no perspective to the issue.

It is only yourself who has actually put some perspective to the argument with your facts and figures about chocolate. Which is quite useful and very informative.

I see nothing that says a small piece of chocolate every now and again will hurt your dog, before your facts it was suggested a zero tolerance approach should be adopted or you are a terrible pet owner!

shaun_from_Africa

The reason that small pieces of chocolate every now and again may cause problems is due to the time it takes the "dodgy" chemical to clear from the dogs system.
This is something I didn't know until I just read it, but according to the vets manual it takes about 17.5 hours for half of the stuff to be excreted, so if someone is giving their pet a small nibble of chocolate once or twice a day then the level of the toxin will be slowing increasing day on day.

All in all, I personally think that for safety sake, stick to giving Fido doggie chocolate drops and not even very small amounts of human chocolate.

Gilbert2

s1lv3rdal5 wrote: »

OP.
It may also be prudent to warn about the dangers of Anti-Freeze to pets.
Even a small amount can Kill, and it happens so quickly, there is often not time to get to a vet.

Dogs that go in a garage and cats that go under cars are at risk.

Also, dogs that don't go into garages, and cats that don't go under cars, are also at risk should they, erm, drink anti-freeze in other places, that you curiously failed to mention.

kitschkitty

I have no idea why the trolls have honed in on this thread, but I'd like to say that I think it's a useful and thought provoking thread and as with all forum threads if people don't want to follow the advice that's up to them, but if you don't know something, you can't make an informed choice.

I'd urge everyone not to bother answering the trolls in this thread as they are being particularly nasty (I normally ignore the trolls, but they're really going the extra mile in this thread so have reported them).

While it's true that the majority of dogs won't have any adverse reactions to grapes, raisins and chocolate (luckily), there is absolutely no benefit to any dog in giving them these foods as a treat (and there are so many other things you could give them with no potential side effects, that they'd find just as tasty), so I don't really see why owners would object to avoiding giving them.

Also for the small minority of owners of dogs who do get ill or die from eating these things, (because their otherwise 100% caring owners just didn't know they could be dangerous) I would imagine that there aren't any owners who would think oh well I will still continue to feed these foods to dogs in future!

Oh and lastly members of this forum could be (and I'm sure some probably are) owners of small breeds which need to consume much lower amounts of these foods to potentially be dangerous to their health. So saying "a dog" will be fine is the most pointless blanket statement.

Oh and to add to the list of things that have cased illness & fatalities in dogs that can easily be avoided (and luckily isn't too commonly used here) is garden mulches/wood chips that are made from cocoa shell/bark.

paddyrg

Won't somebody think of the puppies!

Actually this is an interesting thread and it would be good to know some actual truths about toxicity of various foods to canine biological systems. How does the LD50 compare between grapes and chocolate, sugar and sweeteners, etc. Without real data, we end up with a set of rules and laws based on anecdote, which helps nobody. It's the equivalent of the daily mail front page with its 'X causes/cures cancer' obsession. The world isn't as simple as everything being a cure or cause of something else, biological systems are incredibly complicated.

Now, aggregating a lot of experience of vets where there seems to be a trend of some foods correlating to certain conditions is the starting point for some real study, but the plural of 'anecdote' is not 'evidence', and it may well be that there are some urban myths being created here, belief systems based on fear and hysteria. Or not, who knows? Maybe the Labrador I know who will eat raspberries off the bush and eat Lego and laundry will shorten its own lifespan by its diet, maybe some raisins will be a factor, maybe it'll eat something else that will kill it first.

By all means, feed your dog a balanced canine diet and avoid some foods they'd be less likely too hunt food themselves in the wild (might I suggest raw rabbit?), but be careful of possible hysteria - if is easy to get caught up in it for all the best intended reasons.

OlliesDad

Thanks pulliptears for the info, i doubt i would have even thought about the possible dangers of raisins to a dog.

I'm not sure how ill an animal has to be before Goater78 et al will deem it to be worth mentioning. Presumably even if a dog doesn't die from them, any amount of a poisonous substance in their system will cause some discomfort.

System

OlliesDad wrote: »

Thanks pulliptears for the info, i doubt i would have even thought about the possible dangers of raisins to a dog.

I'm not sure how ill an animal has to be before Goater78 et al will deem it to be worth mentioning. Presumably even if a dog doesn't die from them, any amount of a poisonous substance in their system will cause some discomfort.

My main objection is to people like you who would own a dog without researching into how to take care of it first. Seems terribly irresponsible and a sad indictment of the way people are today.

My other objection is the fact that the things mentioned are clearly not a poisonous substance to dogs in all cases. In moderation a small piece of chocolate every now and again is not going to kill a dog. If a dog eats a raisen its not going to die.

I doubt everything you eat is 100% healthy for you. The trick is not to over indulge.

I find scare threads like this with no real facts behind them dangerous as unfortunately there are many gulliable people (like yourself) who take it at face value just because you've read it "on the internet".

OlliesDad

goater78 wrote: »

My main objection is to people like you who would own a dog without researching into how to take care of it first. Seems terribly irresponsible and a sad indictment of the way people are today.

I did buy a book on dog ownership when i got my puppy, but it does not include in there that raisins can be harmful to dogs. I guess not everything can be covered in a book and therefore you learn new things from information from others (i.e. this thread).

goater78 wrote: »

My other objection is the fact that the things mentioned are clearly not a poisonous substance to dogs in all cases. In moderation a small piece of chocolate every now and again is not going to kill a dog. If a dog eats a raisen its not going to die.

I think you may have missed the fact that in the OP it says that raisins "can be lethal to dogs", this suggests that the OP is well aware that it is not lethal in all cases.

goater78 wrote: »

I find scare threads like this with no real facts behind them dangerous as unfortunately there are many gulliable people (like yourself) who take it at face value just because you've read it "on the internet".

I'm going to ignore the blatant attempt at trolling, however you seem to acknowledge that raisins can be harmful, and therefore i do not see any issue with suggesting that no raisins should be given to a dog at all.

I notice recently you have developed this holier than thou attitude, and i really do wish that we could all someday be as knowledgeable and amazing as you are, however until then, us dimwitted folk use the internet as a resource and often find advice on forums useful.