Northern rock loan over £25,000

downhiller

My argument hinges on the fact that had I been told the CCA only applied up to £25k, I would only have borrowed £25k. I didn't need £30k and had I been told that my loan would be unregulated I would have borrowed the lower amount.

Chrisb80

I have now responded to the FOS with a 3 page letter stating that I cannot accept their decision as I don’t feel they have fully investigated (or commented) on the other valid points raised in my original complaint. These were; TCF principle 7. breach, contractual breach (being afforded the same protections as CCA regulated loan forms part of the contractual agreement for credit), contract validity (inc misrepresentation), continued documentation errors, differences between CCA regulated loan and my current loan terms (NRAM apparently state there are similarities, if so what are they?!), how this is to be rectified moving forward, the uncertainty this still leaves me in etc etc. As it happens I am looking to move home shortly and need certainly around all of these points so that I can make sound financial decisions about my unsecured loan moving forward - the same decisions that I was unable to make when I took the loan out originally!!

One of the points that I have focused on a little more (following the FOS statement “I think it is unlikely that it would have made any difference to your decision to take the loan if NRAM had set out the correct position” ) was that I too did not need to take out a loan of £27k and could have taken less had NRAM set out “the correct position”. It may be hard prove that this would have been my course of action (although harder to prove it wouldn’t), but the purchase of my house did not rely on me talking out the loan that I did and I can prove that I have savings in excess of £2k at the time. Ultimately however, I wasn’t even given the ability to make this decision and how can the FOS or NRAM make assumptions about my decision making process knowing very little about my personal or financial circumstances at the time.

I requested that the FOS provide me with full response on all of these points so that if/when I progress this legally, I can understand their position in its entirety. I haven’t once mentioned any redress on interest paid, as for me although this would be nice, this is not what it’s all about. I still find it amazing that the FOS haven’t touched on any of the above points!

I will be so frustrated if I get a one liner back from the FOS saying “sorry but our decision stands” or something like that having taken the time to set out my concerns in full. Will keep you posted on any progress.....

ginger5092

Hi everyone

Received exactly the same reply from the FOS

I have " crossed swords " recently with the FOS over claims I had with various unscrupulous companys , all to no avail

In my dealings with the FOS I have found them to be unhelpful, unsympathetic and a complete and utter waste of time.

If they are indeed an un biased Government run body, God help us.

Lost the fight now

All the best to you all

lizards

Just out of interest - the original issue (refunds of interest for those under £25K) - how did it come about? I mean, somebody, somewhere must have flagged it as an issue and several somebodies, somewhere took it seriously enough to eventually generate the massive payout without the FOS saying "don't be stupid, you haven't actually lost out in real terms blah blah blah" which is after all pretty much what they're saying here.

In my completely unprofessional and non legal opinion this is just as serious a mistake, if not more so especially as NRAM enforced CCA rules *against* some borrowers as if the loan was CCA covered.

And never mind that some of us, me included, would not have taken over £25K had we known - in fact we only asked for £25K and were offered £30K. We figured the extra 5K would be useful to consolidate what remained of our obviously CCA-regulated debt. I'm fairly sensible and would not have given up a protection like this for the sake of what was basically convenience by having everything all in one place. I thought the only downside would be the extra interest due to extending the term. No CCA protection would have tipped the balance into asking for the smaller loan.

So before I get too sidetracked at my anger at the FOS assuming we'd have taken out the loan regardless of CCA protection, what caused the first issue to go all the way and this one ruled out at such an early stage? If we know the answer to that, perhaps we could try a similar tactic/approach the same people.

tinystar2001

lizards wrote: »

And never mind that some of us, me included, would not have taken over £25K had we known - in fact we only asked for £25K and were offered £30K. We figured the extra 5K would be useful to consolidate what remained of our obviously CCA-regulated debt. I'm fairly sensible and would not have given up a protection like this for the sake of what was basically convenience by having everything all in one place. I thought the only downside would be the extra interest due to extending the term. No CCA protection would have tipped the balance into asking for the smaller loan.

It would seem that it would have made little difference what amount you took out, it is the amount offered that is the issue. We borrowed just over 23k and have statements quoting CCA cover, but were offered 30k and are still waiting for an answer from NRAM regarding our position. The fact that they have had their 8 weeks to reply, which they did the day before the time was up, to request another 4 weeks to look in to it, tells me that even if you had only taken 25k, you would be in the same position you are now, so don't beat yourself up about that. NRAM are in the wrong, not any of us.

lizards

Thanks, that's a very good point actually. There's no way we would have been able to force them to offer us less, where would be the logic?

Coincidentally we've just sold our house and are now rid of NRAM and not a moment too soon. However were it not for the massive interest rate hike we'd have been able to do this quite a bit sooner, but we felt we needed to clear the unsecured part of the loan through overpayments first as the hike was just too excessive. To say this has been inconvenient would be the understatement of the decade..

NorthernRockVictim

Yes, the efforts of all those here are utterly commendable.

I have had prior experience of the FOS, OFT & FSA and sadly all I have ever experienced is a replica of what we're getting back regarding NRAM. In all 3 events the evidence was conclusive, but no matter how much I tried they would not help, and on one occasion admitted that they were short of resources and therefore needed to be selective as to which cases they fully investigate.

I agree with the previous poster, this will need mass exposure to force intervention. We must also remember that the FOS' boss is essentially the government, a questionable conflict of interest.

carlyberyl

Hi all.

Just had our response back from FOS. Word for word response as sent to DrAl above with the exception of the figures, dates, etc. they are not even taking the time to investigate the cases individually and are using too many assumptions 'looking at what happened, I think it is unlikely that it would have made any difference to your decision to take the loan if NRAM had set out the correct position...........' how do they know what difference this would have made to us? They don't. To be sent a generic response is not an accepta le outcome and therefore have made an appointment with our local MP Gloria De Perio, who has extensive links to the media. Will keep you posted on the outcome.

DrAl_2

Short update:
Further to my FOS response earlier in this thread, I have now sent a reply to them outlining that they have not addressed my issues and made assumptions that they are not in a position to make!

I would encourage anyone who has the FOS reply to get back to them if it has not addressed their concerns.

mancpickup

I sent my response rejecting the FOS verdict a couple of weeks ago and have just had a reply today advising they need to get in touch with NRAM for more details. They have not dismissed and are continuing to investigate.

For everyone reading this do not give up just yet!!