Seller won't refund, options?

slam2k5

Hi,

I bought an item from ebay, the seller posted it and it got lost. The seller refused to refund me - £235. I paid the money directly into their bank account so I could get the item quickly as they didn't accept Paypal.

Could anyone please advise me on what my options are? I'm thinking along the lines of a small claims court.

Thanks
S

Browntoa

what item number is it ???

we can see if it looks like a dodgy ebayer

slam2k5

Link here!

There is nothing out of the ordinary I'm afraid, the person has no morales.

soolin

Your only option is the law, unfortunately bank transfers cannot be recalled nor do you get any protection when you use them.

As a seller I love them, as a buyer I would not touch a bank transfer with a bargepole.

However, you do now have a new problem as from 1st April this year the rules changed and now the banks are supposed to deal with fraud themselves, and the police and courts are pushing the onus back to them:

http://www.apacs.org.uk/media_centre/press/30.03.07.html

This Sunday 1 April 2007, new procedures come into effect in England, Wales and Northern Ireland which means that banks and financial institutions become the first point of contact for cheque, plastic card and online fraud offences. In most cases consumers will be required to report instances of this type of fraud straight to their bank or building society and not to the police. It will be up to the financial institution involved, and not the account holder, to pass details of the relevant crime on to the police.

Whilst many legitimate traders accept bank transfers, I do for one! It is also a favoured method for scammers to accept payment as they virtually never get prosecuted or have to return funds. So if using this is a payment method you do need to be 100% sure you fully trust your seller. On ebay ths can take the form of thoroughly checking the feedback, and looking for signs of a hijacked account. Assuming you did all this and the seller had routinely sold high cost items by bank transfer then you might just have a TSFE seller in which case anofficial letter pointing out that you are taking legal advice might get his attention.

Soo

Sugar_Coated_Owl

When you've contacted the seller, what was their reason for not refunding?

Do you know if they sent the item via a trackable method?

slam2k5

Thanks for the replies guys,

I was in contact with the seller for months, I have his name and bank account details so I don't think anything has been hijacked. His e-mail address is a blueyonder account as well.

The reason why he won't refund me is and I quote "why should I be down £235 and a graphics card", the way he see it Royal Mail has lost the parcel so he shouldn't refund me. He didn't take out insurance when posting, the item was sent First Class Recorded but the tracking number he gave me brings up no information on Royal Mail's website.

soolin

slam2k5 wrote: »

Link here!

There is nothing out of the ordinary I'm afraid, the person has no morales.

Sorry but there is a lot out of the ordinary with this auction..firstly the selelr is sendng the item recorded, which any real seller will realise is not the correct postal method. You are virtually assured that the seller will not cough up in the case of loss as they in turn are not covering themselves for loss en route.

Stock photos and poor feedback should be enough to have set some alarm bells ringing. Also a look at completed sales seems to suggest, on a quick look, that he has sold a great deal more recently than he has feedback for, this could indicate that people aren't getting their goods and are yet to leave feedback, or that they are in dispute and again feedback won't be left until that is sorted.

This seller might be OK but just a bit naive as to how the postal service works, but there is enough there to make most buyers walk away if they can't use paypal backed by a credit card.

slam2k5

Hi,

I can understand what you're saying, the seller had sold identical items and people received them no problem. I personally don't think there is anything dody about the seller, like I say I have a name and bank account details with Nationwide. He just doesn't see why he has to refund my money because Royal Mail has lost the parcel. People still continue to buy from this seller. So I'm looking at my options to recover my money, I want to make it as difficult as possible for him to keep it.

Thanks again
S

soolin

Strangely enough the fact that he seems legit might make it harder for you to reclaim your money.

I'm not good at explaining things sometimes, so stick with me! If this was out and out fraud then under the new rules you could go to your bank and they might be able to help you reclaim money through a claim for fraudulent behaviour, I say might because banks are notorious at not wanting to get involved where people have used bank transfers as it is usually done directly by the customer without any bank monitoring. Whether the new powers, if any, since April 1st would have helped with such a claim I don't know.

However, since the seller appears to be legit you can't claim fraud, all you can say to the bank is that you paid for something, which the buyer sent and which has got lost. I can't see the banks being interested at all in that scenario. Assuming the seller is legit this is just a case of a seller who fails to understand the need for insurance, the royal mail doing what they often do (lose or delay items) and a buyer who has neither his money or the goods. I can only assume that the banks will say this is nothing to do with them, and since the police will just refer you back to then bank, your only recourse appears to be via the Royal mail, and I wouldn't hold my breath.

Someone with a better understanding of the rules since 1st April might be able to advise you better, maybe say whether you do still have recourse to the law if the police and the bank aren't interested. However, do remember that going to the small claims will cost you, and you will still have to prove your case against the seller, and even if you win you have no way of forcing payment.

Hopefully someone else here will have some other ideas as to what to do next?

Sugar_Coated_Owl

I think I'd go down the small claims court route. The seller should have sent it via an appropriate method. He/she could have protected himself from losing out but chose not to. It's the sellers responsibilty to ensure that the item is posted and delivered to you.

I would email the seller and give them one last chance to refund in full. If they still say no then I would advise them that you have no other option but to file a claim with the small claims court in order to retrieve your money.

Sugar_Coated_Owl

Yes as Soolin mentioned even if you do win they may not pay up. Not eBay related but I took my ex to the small claims court and won but I've never seen the money. He wasn't forced to pay up. I ended up another £70 down as that is what it cost me to take him to court