gap between classing dates and interview.

studentphil

brazilianwax wrote: »

Not true.

The Director of my organisation is a philosophy graduate. As is my favourite colleague - a very senior man.

They are both very different, both in their 40s, and both have different approaches. I didn't know that the non-Director was a philosophy graduate because he seemed so normal! The reason I like him is because, like me, we operate on a common sense basis, and improving things is something we are both good at. There is a right way and a wrong way to do that though.

The Director is a bit more flimsy in his thinking. :rolleyes:

But the point is that they both came in at the bottom, new out of uni, and have worked their way up to the top.

Phil, if you define yourself forever only as a philosopher, you may struggle. If you work hard, and learn about the world of work, your philosophy degree could benefit you, and enable you to actively improve places. But don;t run before you can walk.

It will be different in non- university setting because many people do not even know what philosophy is. I think a lot of people think it is some lesser relation to psychology, which it is not.

The careers woman says to me go down the route of looking at working for smaller businesses as she thinks I would like that as it require working across a wide range of issues.

studentphil

melancholly wrote: »

in all aspects of science, you have to question whether any evidence does what it says it does - it's called critical thinking and it is not a skill unique to philosphers!

please stop using your subject choice as an excuse for everything - a philosophy course is as much use to an employer in business as cell biology, maths or english. many employers prefer you not to have done a business related degree as it means you are a blank canvas and can be taught their way of doing things more easily.

if anyone went into a job with no experience and kept telling their boss they were wrong, it would go down badly.... that's a poor decision and should be blamed on shocking inter-personal skills and not on a subject!

seeing as you haven't had an interview yet, let alone any work experience or a job, maybe you could try to open up your mind (in a philosophical way if that helps you) and get rid of your baseless inaccurate generalisations.

Oh you have me wrong, I have a lot of work experience but I admit almost none of it was paid.

No one seriously suggested telling a boss they were wrong. I think telling someone they are wrong is far stronger than what philosophy in fact teaches you. It teaches you to ask why and to ask for reasoning and not to just pick holes.

Personally all this idea of being a blank canvas if you are not from business is highly concerning. Brain washing in company culture only produces yes men and women and thus makes your staff less adaptable and less able to think outside the box. If you are going to want non- business students their advantage is far more that they can bring a different view to business students and thus to create a check and balance through a balanced workforce.

melancholly

studentphil wrote: »

Personally all this idea of being a blank canvas if you are not from business is highly concerning. Brain washing in company culture only produces yes men and women and thus makes your staff less adaptable and less able to think outside the box.

Or it gives you less know-it-all graduates with no practical experience who want to use their theory to tell experienced members of staff what to do!

It's not brain washing. If a multinational company, making huge profits, has a certain way of doing things, then one single graduate entry level worker is not going to be in any position to suggest other 'better' appraoches. It's not about 'yes men and women' - it was, in fact, meant to suggest that the degree you have will not hinder you getting a job, but feel free to misinterpret it and find yet more sweeping complaints about things you don't know about.

I mean, seriously, do you know how you sound in your posts? You hate something about every industry, yet they should all employ you! You are not very knowledgable and yet rather than ask, or indeed listen, you stick to your preconceived ideas. That's not adaptable. You don't read what people say, you read what you want to hear.

Incidentally, I'm sure I'm not the only person who hears the terms 'blue sky thinking' and 'thinking outside the box' and wants to retch! They are terms that make me shudder in meetings and sound like quotes from the office!

sarahlouise210

studentphil wrote: »

I do not want a call centre job as it is looked down on by most people. I do not want to be looked down on and thought to be a waster.

How very dare you talk of people who work in call centres in this way:mad:

I have read a few of your comments and cannot believe how biggoted you are with regards to certain occupatons ...it is open discrimination on your part (something you yourself will NOT tolerate ????:rolleyes: )

You have no idea of how the real world works. You think that you should sail into a top paid job..because you have what it takes to make a difference to the world:rotfl: ...over the months we have come to know you(how ever many there are) I have seen no evidence of this amazing quality you have that will be such an assett to potential employers. You are indecisive, do not listen to others, rely on others for opnions or have very narrow minded opinions of your own, you have poor literacy and grammar skills (strangle this varies from day to day:rolleyes: ) I could go on....but you know the rest.

It does not matter how long you have studied....your future is in your hands and a call centre environment may just be the right one for you. You talk on the phone therefore there is no face to face contact. You will more than likely be able to choose your own trousers (!!!), you will be given set rules and training on scenarios and this will help you with your indecision. You will have a spell check for any letters you have to send out! There are plus points.

For you to insinuate that every call centre worker is a moron with no GCSE`s or ambition is frankly a disgrace. Shame on you Studentphil :mad:

susy_2

Phil, I have followed your posts for some time now. I have defended you when people have been incredibly offensive of/to you, but I am now totally exasperated by you.

You say that you are in your final year of a philosphy degree. Well I am sorry Phil, but I see nothing of the philosopher in you. I have seen your attempts at philosphy threads and as soon as people pick them up to debate, you drop out. In fact the only threads that you are sucessful with are the 'Phil' threads. These can run forever because the truth is, that you only ever want to talk about yourself.......................constantly.

You show no interest or empathy of other people at all. In fact when other people start conversations, Phil disappears. I am sure this comes across on your job applications and maybe this is why you are unsuccessful. The key phrase these days seems to be team member. I don't think you are capable of this Phil.

You are very literal/rigid in your interpretations, thoughts and responses. (Something that doesn't really sit with Philosopy). Some people are this way, through no fault of their own, unfortunately. I say unfortunately because it marks you out as being different and is perhaps something you need to work on.

Many, many people on mse have tried to give you very good advice, their time, their expertise and experiences, but it is clear they are beginning to lose patience with you Phil and eventually, this thread is going to finish and guess what! You will start/hijack a new one and the cycle will start again.

You have been a member of mse for 9 months and in that time you have posted a total of 12,631 posts. An incredible average of 45 per day????? You appear to be online all day, every day. In fact, I don't know when you have found the time to attend Uni, or see friends. In fact I have doubts about a lot of what you say. I think you are lonely Phil and mse is your company. That's ok, that's fine, but you need to learn to actively interact!

Well, I will go now before I end up writing an essay! I do not wish to be cruel or unkind, but actually, I think this will just bounce off you, (returned - marked unread) as do so many other posts.

I wish you well Phil and hope that we will talk again, but until you have something to say that is not about Phil, I think I will be taking a back seat.

Tam_Lin

studentphil wrote: »

Philosophy is bad for employment in that it encourages you to say when you think something is wrong and I doubt that goes down well with many bosses.

Rubbish. Unless directly required by the job, the subject of the degree is irrelevant if the applicant can show that they have self-discipline, maturity and practicality. You have this bizarre idea that departments want a yes-man; that has never been the case in any of the places where I have worked or applicants I have interviewed. What we look for is solid evidence to back up any claims made on the CV and ask for specific examples. If they say they are pro-active, how has that been evidenced. If they say they are motivated enough to work autonomously, where is the example of the project completed with minimal oversight. Sorting out the wafflers saying what they think we want to hear, from applicants who would be right for the job.

studentphil

sarahlouise210 wrote: »

How very dare you talk of people who work in call centres in this way:mad:

I have read a few of your comments and cannot believe how biggoted you are with regards to certain occupatons ...it is open discrimination on your part (something you yourself will NOT tolerate ????:rolleyes: )

You have no idea of how the real world works. You think that you should sail into a top paid job..because you have what it takes to make a difference to the world:rotfl: ...over the months we have come to know you(how ever many there are) I have seen no evidence of this amazing quality you have that will be such an assett to potential employers. You are indecisive, do not listen to others, rely on others for opnions or have very narrow minded opinions of your own, you have poor literacy and grammar skills (strangle this varies from day to day:rolleyes: ) I could go on....but you know the rest.

It does not matter how long you have studied....your future is in your hands and a call centre environment may just be the right one for you. You talk on the phone therefore there is no face to face contact. You will more than likely be able to choose your own trousers (!!!), you will be given set rules and training on scenarios and this will help you with your indecision. You will have a spell check for any letters you have to send out! There are plus points.

For you to insinuate that every call centre worker is a moron with no GCSE`s or ambition is frankly a disgrace. Shame on you Studentphil :mad:

That is not my view of call centres. People look down on you a lot if you work at a call centre and I do not want a job where people look down on you for having. That is my objection to call centres not that the people who work there are bad or anything of that nature.

studentphil

susy wrote: »

Phil, I have followed your posts for some time now. I have defended you when people have been incredibly offensive of/to you, but I am now totally exasperated by you.

You say that you are in your final year of a philosphy degree. Well I am sorry Phil, but I see nothing of the philosopher in you. I have seen your attempts at philosphy threads and as soon as people pick them up to debate, you drop out. In fact the only threads that you are sucessful with are the 'Phil' threads. These can run forever because the truth is, that you only ever want to talk about yourself.......................constantly.

You show no interest or empathy of other people at all. In fact when other people start conversations, Phil disappears. I am sure this comes across on your job applications and maybe this is why you are unsuccessful. The key phrase these days seems to be team member. I don't think you are capable of this Phil.

You are very literal/rigid in your interpretations, thoughts and responses. (Something that doesn't really sit with Philosopy). Some people are this way, through no fault of their own, unfortunately. I say unfortunately because it marks you out as being different and is perhaps something you need to work on.

Many, many people on mse have tried to give you very good advice, their time, their expertise and experiences, but it is clear they are beginning to lose patience with you Phil and eventually, this thread is going to finish and guess what! You will start/hijack a new one and the cycle will start again.

You have been a member of mse for 9 months and in that time you have posted a total of 12,631 posts. An incredible average of 45 per day????? You appear to be online all day, every day. In fact, I don't know when you have found the time to attend Uni, or see friends. In fact I have doubts about a lot of what you say. I think you are lonely Phil and mse is your company. That's ok, that's fine, but you need to learn to actively interact!

Well, I will go now before I end up writing an essay! I do not wish to be cruel or unkind, but actually, I think this will just bounce off you, (returned - marked unread) as do so many other posts.

I wish you well Phil and hope that we will talk again, but until you have something to say that is not about Phil, I think I will be taking a back seat.

I do have emotional barriers to things and I sit here a lot suffering with destressed and worrying. That is the side of me you often see here. But I have got positive elements to me.

studentphil

I know I am not perfect and maybe I should have died at birth and then all the world would have been saved from such an awful and bad person like me.

Some people want to be Doctors or teachers and because I want to work at a university it makes me an evil close minded person and yet other people are not evil for knowing what career they want.

Need_More_Money_2

studentphil wrote: »

I know I am not perfect and maybe I should have died at birth and then all the world would have been saved from such an awful and bad person like me.

Some people want to be Doctors or teachers and because I want to work at a university it makes me an evil close minded person and yet other people are not evil for knowing what career they want.

This really reads as the sort of post I might expect from a 12 year old. I cannot believe a 21 year old (who nearly has a degree) would post something so immature