Staff Dogs and Muzzles

mixenvixen

Can someone please explain this argument to me, because I genuinely don't think I get....

Have I got this right?

goater78 says their friend couldn't get insurance for Staffies for his doggy day care.
(Although slightly discriminatory of the insurance company. Not really that ridiculous to believe).

So Liam8282 says this is 'RUBBISH'.

Surely then goater to prove his point has to only come up with ONE insurance company that will not accept Staffies.

goater has provided an insurance company.

Surely his point is proved correct and that there is at least one insurance company that will not accept staffies??

The only way that you could prove your point liam8282 would be to list every insurance company in the UK and there policy on Staffies, thus proving your point that no insurance company has this policy??

liam8282

mixenvixen wrote: »

Can someone please explain this argument to me, because I genuinely don't think I get....

Have I got this right?

goater78 says their friend couldn't get insurance for Staffies for his doggy day care.
(Although slightly discriminatory of the insurance company. Not really that ridiculous to believe).

So Liam8282 says this is 'RUBBISH'.

Surely then goater to prove his point has to only come up with ONE insurance company that will not accept Staffies.

goater has provided an insurance company.

Surely his point is proved correct and that there is at least one insurance company that will not accept staffies??

The only way that you could prove your point liam8282 would be to list every insurance company in the UK and there policy on Staffies, thus proving your point that no insurance company has this policy??

First of all I cannot produce evidence of a policy which does not exist, which is probably why goater and gregg have had so much difficulty in finding any insurance company that has that policy.

What I can do and have done is provide evidence that private insurance is readily available for SBT, somebody else provided evidence that business insurance is available with no exception to the SBT breed.

You were nearly correct in your summary of the debate, except that goater hasn't provided an insurance company that will not insure SBT. Quite the opposite in fact, he named a couple of businesses that will not accept SBT for the owners personal reasons and a link to a website which actually takes you to other websites that insure SBT.

My point all along has been that it is not the breed of dog that should be in question or even debated here.

I don't really have any argument, this has just been dragged out by goater and gregg with various different arguments along the way.

My point has always been the same.

Helen2k8

I don't know why I've read page after page of argument over insurance. Mind you, if someone tells me "my friend had trouble getting insurance for their Vauxhall Corsa" I would think "hmm, that sucks, I wonder if it's because that model is popular with a certain set of idiot".

Telling them they're talking rubbish and proceeding to trawl through insurers and demanding they do the same...well....all a bit pointless really.



Back to the OP - how is puppy now? And what the hell are you doing buying a second puppy?? Not just because first pup needs your attention and training (and vaccinations, and money) but because you're draining the PDSA. It's a safety net, not a lifestyle choice you know

moggymutt

Really cant follow all of the aguments, but as regards proving the agument over business insurance for staffies.

Proof that businesses CAN get insurance for staffies needs only ONE example to prove it CAN be done. To prove that businesses CANT get insurance for staffies would involve an exhaustive search to prove that there is ABSOLUTELY NOT EVEN ONE single insurance company that would provide cover. By exhaustive that means you would have to check with every single insurance company in the world.

gregg1

moggymutt wrote: »

Really cant follow all of the aguments, but as regards proving the agument over business insurance for staffies.

Proof that businesses CAN get insurance for staffies needs only ONE example to prove it CAN be done. To prove that businesses CANT get insurance for staffies would involve an exhaustive search to prove that there is ABSOLUTELY NOT EVEN ONE single insurance company that would provide cover. By exhaustive that means you would have to check with every single insurance company in the world.

Exactly. That is the point "liam" found difficult to grasp.

I was certainly not saying insurance could not be found at all, merely mentioning an issue someone who I know had when trying to sort out kennels for her dog. If he had read my post properly before he kicked off, I might have taken him more seriously.

Jojo_the_Tightfisted

Back to the original post;

No insurance, vaccinations done too early...I'm thinking puppy farm/back yard breeder. You need to get him checked for parvo pretty sharpish.

Another pup is not a good idea if you can't afford the treatment and other expenses associated with one dog. Even less of a good idea if it's another puppy farmer.


Did you check the PDSA rules? They only cover one pedigree nowdays. And no chopping and changing registrations. So if anything happens to pup 2, you probably can't afford anything other than having it put to sleep.

A pup so young should only have been outside for a few minutes - especially with a breed infamous for hip problems. Unless you live next door to the park, he was probably being overexercised.


And finally - you say a staff is big? You have a very large surprise coming your way in about nine months time. And you can expect random strangers to complain yours isn't muzzled as it's been bred to attack just as you complain about staffies.


I'm not picking on you. These are facts and my opinion. Not to upset or point score. But you do seem a little underinformed.

I hope the pup recovers well.

Gunarysarge

First of all I hope Bear makes a full recovery and you all learn from this, but most important move-on and enjoy your walks . The OP will now need to put some work in as regards the staffy, to make sure this sort of thing does not happen again. They need to seak advice as regards training etc.
I have read alot of the replies but not all, some of them are complete tosh imo. To say that all dogs must be kept on a leash in a public place is cruel and un-educated, as is to state that all dogs must wear a muzzle . Of course some dog's are rescue animals that have been raised in a bad way or beaten/mistreated? In these cases the dog may need a muzzle and be on a leash while it is being walked until the new owner can put in some groundwork/training. There is no such thing as a dangerous breed:mad: as any dog when raised,loved and trained in the correct way will become completely trustworthy and be no threat to anyone. My brother who lives in the states owns an American Pitball:shocked: That dog is a joy and love's people and other dogs because My brother raised him in the correct way. They are pack animals and the owner must act as the leader at all times, its when the dog thinks that it is the leader or is unsure who the leader is because boundarys are not set that problem's start. Bad dog? No!
Bad owner? Maybe!

pamperedprincess

Just want to point out that it is not just staffies that are nasty. My 2yr old chocolate labrador who I've had from 8wks will go for other dogs if they come near her or me as she's over protective, we do muzzle her though.

We also have a chocolate lab who does this. She has no problems with other dogs unless they approach her or god forbid, try to take her ball..... Our previous dog was a staffie. He was a very placid and lovely dog who never showed any signs of nastiness to other dogs.

I hope Bear makes a full recovery but no one should have a dog without insurance unless they have very deep pockets. Vet bills can be huge.

kajstring24

This is a topic very close to my heart, I get so angry when I hear people condemning Staffies and claiming they know more about these dogs because of something they read in the papers. All dogs can be unpredictable, and I'm wary when taking my parent's Staff near other dogs. He's daft as a brush, he likes to rest his head on your knee when he wants attention and will lie next to you for the rest of his life if you give him fuss. He loves nothing more than to cuddle on the sofa. However, he's a strong boy and my parents are currently working very hard to train him to not pull on the lead. He can sometimes 'latch on' when play fighting, but he knows immediately not apply pressure and will let go (some of you may ask how we can be certain that he knows, but he's never tried to bite aggressively and understands that if you turn your back on him, then play time is over). I trust him completely, he just doesn't know his own strength. I would never expect him to act aggressively towards another dog or human.

However, you can never be too sure. I've been attacked by a male Staffie who we believe was trying to show dominance (I was only about 11). He was put to sleep immediately and we were heartbroken. We'd had him for several years and this obviously came as a huge shock. Luckily I wasn't hurt and we got a !!!!! a year after. She was put to sleep last November (gorgeous girl, absolutely beautiful and well-mannered. No problems whatsoever).

I love Staffies, despite a bad experience. As I've grown up I've come to realise that all dogs have an element of risk and must be trained accordingly. People who dismiss breeds based on opinion from other ignoramuses really annoy me, and it's people like this who damage reputations (don't get me started on the chavs that also contribute to this). Unfortunately, Staffies are one breed who have suffered this unfortunate and unfair labelling.

Blame the owner not the breed!

kiss_me_now9

mixenvixen wrote: »

I'm sure this will get a a lot of back lash, as there are obviously a lot of dog lovers on this board, but I personally find most dogs intimidating- regardless of type.

I understand they give people a lot of love and to a lot of people can be a member of the family. It may just be because I have never personally had a dog (and on the flip side a lot of people I know who have never had cats dislike them) but I would rather people keep them on leashes in public and if they are aggressive take them to behavioural classes.

I know we should love all our animal friends- but when your dog barks at me or you let it come over and touch me, it makes me feel really uncomfortable. One of my brothers has aspergers syndrome and this makes him feel incredibly uncomfortable. I know some people have compared this to a child (i.e. what if a child did this?), but to be honest I can't really recall finding a small child that intimidating or them biting me to the extent in which this original assault was described.

I just thought I would bring in a point, that to non- dog lovers (sorry! Please don't persecute me for saying this! I really do respect your right to have one!) dogs seem pretty mean regardless of type. I know this may sound unfair. In a similar way its unfair to assume anyone wearing a hood is going to mug you. But just like a lot of people want youths to realise they can intimidate some people, I really wish some (not all!) dog owners would realise the same.

**Just my personal opinions!**

I'm the same - I've had cats all my life and in the past few years, have had about four incidents where I've been walking out and about and an aggressive dog has gone for me. As such I find dogs in open spaces quite hard to deal with and I hate walking through parks where dogs are off the lead I know 9/10 dogs are lovely and friendly but I seem to attract the nutcase ones with terrible owners who just don't care.

It is really quite scary - if you're me at least - to have a dog charge up to you in an open area and not know what it's going to do or how it's going to react. I can't read dogs at all; for all I know the loopy looking expression is the first warning before it rips my arm off. Stick me in a field of boisterous Shire horses and I'm fine, leave me alone with a small breed dog and I quiver.

I do, one day, want to get my own dog - I have met some lovely dogs - but I think through and through I'm a cat person.