Economy 7 meter removed - and we save - can we backdate?

jalexa

Cardew wrote: »

Well it isn't often I disagree with the very knowledgeable Terry!

The forum would be very sterile without healthy debate and I tend to agree with you, though with some caveats.

If the "issue" is accepted then every single house move to a single rate metering installation would require the householder to be canvased on the "possible" benefits if E7. As has been pointed out, the supplier's adviser cannot second-guess a new householder's lifestyle in a new property.

I'm already concerned at the data protection implications of what has been "claimed" said about the previous householder's consumption pattern. While EAC provided by the metering company (help Terry) is valid, to reveal account based data IMO would be a breach of Data Protection.

In one respect I am partly with Terry. The quality of Adviser advice is IME extremely variable. That, and an "uninformed customer", is a recipe for disaster because so much can hang on a technical misunderstanding. So what *exactly* was asked and what *exactly* was said might be relevant. But I do not think the supplier is in any way bound to go beyond registering account details for the installed metering system.

Buzby

Conversely, I no longer have storage radiators, but because we used the off-peak circuit to feed systems that are useful overnight, my usage is 38% overnight on average, making E7 a continuing cost saving - so it is imperative users check regularly by noting their usage each time there is a tariff hike.

Terrylw1

Cardew wrote: »

Well it isn't often I disagree with the very knowledgeable Terry! however as this is 'opinion' and not factual information!!!

There are some 20 million electrical customers. To get down to advising every new customer of the ramifications of every tariff would just not be feasible.

What is sensible for one customer, where the whole household gets up early and uses lots of off-peak electricity in the morning, won't apply to another household.

As stated above, E7 may be unsuitable for a household on a BG tariff, but that may not apply to say Scottish power where the 'break-even' percentage is much lower.

Even British Gas have changed their E7 tariff structure so the break-even point has varied over the last few years between 20% and the current 40% on some of their tariffs.

Once you start offering advice to the 20 million on a suitable tariff you have 'hold of a tiger by the tail'. Every change to a tariff structure that could possibly affect a customer would have to have the implications discussed with the customer.

Can you imagine the complaints to the Energy Ombudsman - 'I was told by BG in 2001 that E7 was the best tariff for me, but I had gas CH installed in 2002 and I wasn't told that I should have moved from E7, so for 10 years I have paid too much - compensation please!!'

caveat emptor

I do agree with you in that its very complicated and in the case of a change in occupancy, the supplier could do more damage than good as they could easily compromise the ability to benefit from a later switch.

I think a lot of the problems are also the change in lifestyle. I remember a while back, a supplier argument where it was assumed that all E7 customers they had would use their night hours for heating and hardly any 24hr appliance use. After pointing out we have many night workers these days I got a "oh yeah".

From the EAC, this can easily be separated into pots of a) needs standard as nowhere near the threshold b) is in the band where it could b either way based on the varying industry price issues and c) those who definitely need it. Its just data after all. So, suppliers can do this. Its also how the % split if an EAC is derived when creating or updated it in the industry as the minimum per register has to be established.

I also think its potentially hard for a call centre advisor to do this and probably wouldn't be very popular with their managers given the extra time.

I see it as being the responsibility of both parties. Whilst it might be hard to get this data at the point of sale, it could be part of a review afterwards. The do it with the DD's.

My issue is that a supplier is very quick to state its all the customers responsibility when they know they should be offering advice at the least. It seems that they are quick to sign up customers but don't have a conversation about tariffs unless we ask.

Terrylw1

jalexa wrote: »

The forum would be very sterile without healthy debate and I tend to agree with you, though with some caveats.

If the "issue" is accepted then every single house move to a single rate metering installation would require the householder to be canvased on the "possible" benefits if E7. As has been pointed out, the supplier's adviser cannot second-guess a new householder's lifestyle in a new property.

I'm already concerned at the data protection implications of what has been "claimed" said about the previous householder's consumption pattern. While EAC provided by the metering company (help Terry) is valid, to reveal account based data IMO would be a breach of Data Protection.

In one respect I am partly with Terry. The quality of Adviser advice is IME extremely variable. That, and an "uninformed customer", is a recipe for disaster because so much can hang on a technical misunderstanding. So what *exactly* was asked and what *exactly* was said might be relevant. But I do not think the supplier is in any way bound to go beyond registering account details for the installed metering system.

I wonder if they consider the EAC to be for the site, not the customer? This data will be stored against the MPAN but in seperate data flow handling systems. It will link behind the scenes but may not appear on the customers account.

Its a tricky issue on advising on products. Past experience has been that some people will stick to the bill, others will back down or compromise.

I just don't rule out the fact a supplier may look back and decide they could have done it better. But I don't think a supplier can hide behind a statement when in investigating, there could be more evidence making the situation slightly more cloudy.

Landlords for instance are well known for cutting costs by installing GCH but not changing elec meters to save some cash. Whilst this is the landlords fault, the supplier can see this reflected in the pattern change unless the customer really does use a lot in the night.