sacked without warning self employed

jodie04

hi all,
this is probably in the wrong bit, but couldn't find anywhere else it would go.....
I've been self employed with the same company for 4 years cleaning, i send them an invoice for 6 months in advance which has always worked well
but just after they paid there 6months they decided they wanted the office cleaning at different times, which i couldn't do due to family commitments
i wanted to know whether i'm entitled to any notice or whether i just have to pay them all the money back?
thanks in advance

Savvy_Sue

You were self-employed: what did your contract with them state? what terms did you agree? I'm afraid that's one of the pitfalls of being self-employed: if you don't set that kind of thing out in writing, you'll have very little recourse if they decide that your services no longer meet their needs.

So, unless you have it in writing that you will do the cleaning at a particular time, and / or unless you have it in writing that either party will give a certain amount of notice, I think you're going to struggle here.

But I'm not an expert, others may disagree with me.

jodie04

no contract of any sort, started out as me doing a favor for a friend, don't suppose they can do anything if i offer to pay it back in installments???? can they

trailingspouse

Have they asked for the money back? Don't offer it to them until they ask, and then negotiate like billy-o. If there's not contract, then you're not breaking the contract by refusing to give them their money back, although you might decide it's politic to do so.

If you're self-employed, you can't be sacked. You just lose a contract. You should always be looking to the next contract, and the one after that.

CKhalvashi

trailingspouse wrote: »

If you're self-employed, you can't be sacked. You just lose a contract. You should always be looking to the next contract, and the one after that.

Very true.

We've won contracts, we've lost contracts, we've bought contracts as a result of buying other companies, including buying some contracts back.

We supply, 9 times out of 10, some pretty flexible people, so it doesn't matter if we can't get a 1st choice, as long as we get a second, however unless you've been specifically employed by them, there's not a lot that can be done.

CK

whitewing

If OP is being paid 6 months in advance, why would she not be entitled to work out that amount of time?

Nednats

Under certain circumstances you maybe considered as a worker, which will give some rights as an employee. you maybe able to go to an employment tribunal even if you are self-employed.

If you work at your employer's premises and use your employer's tools and/or facilities, work exclusively for one business rather than performing work for a number of 'customers', and are paid a regular salary you are worker

Savvy_Sue

whitewing wrote: »

If OP is being paid 6 months in advance, why would she not be entitled to work out that amount of time?

She may indeed be entitled to, but the hours she can offer / is willing to work are not those which suit the company for whom she was working.

She can suggest that until the end of the period they've paid her for that she works her original hours, or perhaps there's some compromise possible there, but if there's nothing in writing then I can foresee this being difficult.

Let's face it, rather than employing a cleaner to whom they would have been obliged to pay holiday pay, SSP etc they have decided to pay someone who's self-employed. Much cheaper to get rid of if no longer needed.

Nednat's points are valid, but going to an employment tribunal isn't a quick fix. I'd suggest getting legal advice before going down that route, although it may be a bargaining point: "pay me 3 months notice and I won't take it any further", say.

Mersey_2

Good point re being deemed a 'worker'

The Court of Appeal ruled, last month, in Hospital Medical Group v Westwood, that the self-employed can be entitled to holiday pay, if you work at the same premises and so on.

Wywth

jodie04 wrote: »

hi all,
this is probably in the wrong bit, but couldn't find anywhere else it would go.....
I've been self employed with the same company for 4 years cleaning, i send them an invoice for 6 months in advance which has always worked well
but just after they paid there 6months they decided they wanted the office cleaning at different times, which i couldn't do due to family commitments
i wanted to know whether i'm entitled to any notice or whether i just have to pay them all the money back?
thanks in advance

Self employed and sacked?

Have a word with yourself!

bni

You are in a strong position, they have paid 6 months in advance without a written agreement and the only way they could recover any money from you is by suing you in civil court. Not saying they couldn't be successful in winning a judgment for some of the money to be returned, but I doubt that they would pursue it in this situation.

I think that you should politely point out that when they paid you for the last invoice it was on the previously agreed cleaning times. If they want to unilaterally change the time and you can't accomodate them then there is no obligation for you to go back on the deal to suit them.

If you want to be nice, you could offer them say 50% back as you won't be providing the service going forward and keep the rest as your fee for terminating the contract early.