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Moral Dilema - help

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  • Ladyhawk
    Ladyhawk Posts: 2,064 Forumite
    McKneff wrote: »
    :T
    While Im thinking, did you ask if he had public liability insurance, its amazing how easy a small tree top can reduce a shed to matchwood.

    I've been thinking about this post for a day or so now and am actually slightly concerned that this young guy does not have the right tools for the job. If he doesn't have the right tools, he is unlikely to have the right training to carry out his business safely. He is also unlikely to have any insurance whatsoever. Is there a licencing scheme or trade body for tree surgeons that you could suggest he gets in touch with?

    For my 2 pence worth I'd pay his to cover his costs and a little bit extra but certainly not the full fee.
    Man plans and God laughs...
    Perhaps travel cannot prevent bigotry. But by demonstrating that all people cry, laugh, eat, worry and die, it introduces the idea that if we try to understand each other, we may even become friends.
  • keystone
    keystone Posts: 10,916 Forumite
    You don't need to be a tree surgeon to trim a conifer. Guy's a gardener. He's just starting up in business. OPs probably got a cheap price for doing this but hasn't admitted it and here this thread is pillorying the poor lad for actually trying to make a go of something instead of sponging off the state.

    Yes he should have PLI, yes he should have PAI too. We have no idea that he doesn't so
    He is also unlikely to have any insurance whatsoever
    is nothing less than a serious WAG and less tha helpful.

    Cheers
    The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has it's limits. - Einstein
  • rxbren
    rxbren Posts: 413 Forumite
    edited 16 September 2012 at 10:23PM
    pli isnt a legal requirement
    and if peope are paying as little as possible the only people they will get will have no insurance as lets face it a fully insured person/company will push the price up to cover there costs

    to say the lad had the wrong tools is a bit unfair all he needs is a saw!
    sure it would make his life easier if he had a chainsaw (which he would have to charge you extra for) but a handsaw will sufice in cutting wood/branches

    the lad trid to leave you with some green left on your hedge, what would you have said if it was 7' high and bare then next year didnt grow back again. fair enough he should have called to check but there is nothing stopping him coming back with a saw/chainsaw and finishing off as lets face it its a bit of wood

    he may have also had another reason for stopping short he may have misjudged the waste from the cutting, did he have a skip or have a tipper/flatbed the extra price may have meant him not making any money on the job or having to try and charge you for the extra removal charge

    its only fair you pay him for the work he has done and for the removal costs you could always come to some agreement over his actual pay from the job for the difference in height.

    to get someone else in to take off 3' and to remove it could cost the same/more than what he quoted for the WHOLE job
  • Sounds like he did a decent enough job for a customer who wanted it all for a pittance. He should have just botched it and cut down to dead wood and you would have been left wondering why your confiers weren't growing back. Info freely available on tinternet about how most conifers will not grow back if trimmed too harshly past teh green growth

    How tall were the trees originally as he should have been able to advise you about how much you coul realistically have trimmed off
  • rca779
    rca779 Posts: 462 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 100 Posts Name Dropper
    I think I need to clear up one or two things

    1. I didn't just go with this lad because he gave the cheapest quote. In fact he was the only one I got a quote from, he sounded as if he knew what he was doing and I was impressed that he had set himself up on his own and I was pleased to be able to offer him the work.
    2. There is plenty of greenery should the hedge be cut back to 7'.
    3. I did offer the lad the opportunity to complete the job. It is his opinion that the cannot complete it.
    4. The lad did not have the necessary tools to complete the job. He had to borrow my neighbours ladder just to reach the hedge as his step ladders he brought along weren't big enough. From what my neighbour said, he had cheapish looking DIY tools that simply weren't man enough to do the job.
    this thread is pillorying the poor lad for actually trying to make a go of something instead of sponging off the state.
    That certainly wasn't my intention, as stated above I was really impressed that he was making a go of things.
    customer who wanted it all for a pittance
    Not at all, his was the only quote I got (my mistake?) and I simply accepted it. It was actually more than I expected but was happy to go with it and believed he would do a good job.
  • As I said how tall were trees originally?
    Have you looked inside the trees from above? Just because you think there is plenty of greenery on outside to cut back doesn't mean there is on conifers, especially if they are to look half decent

    Might be cheaper to have them removed and some decent trees put in instead as a side point anyway. unless you trim them several times a year in small amounts they are hard to keep looking nice
  • rca779
    rca779 Posts: 462 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 100 Posts Name Dropper
    Parts of the trees had grown to over 20'.
    My next door neighbour had asked not to cut them back as they provided plenty of shade for their garden.

    TBH, so long as they look green at the front, that's all I am worried about. They are never going to look good on top, hence the reason of keeping them 7' high so that no one can see the top.

    I normally trim the front twice a year to keep it neat and tidy and if trimmed to 7' I can control the top as well to stop them overgrowing again!
  • You cannot trim a 20' conifer to 7' in one cut without risk of killing it. Any decent tree surgeon would probably tell you the same. Point about the middle of the tree is conifers do not re-grow from dead wood
    Once they have grown beyond help untreated they may not be able to be trimmed as you would like them

    Personally I would pay pay the guy
  • rca779
    rca779 Posts: 462 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 100 Posts Name Dropper
    Well two "proper" tree surgeons have looked at the hedge this evening and thought that it was no problem to cut the hedge down to the 7' height I want.

    I also checked the business card of the lad that made the first attempt and it states that he is Merrist Wood trained and fully insured.

    I still don't believe that I should pay the lad the full amount as he didn't fulfil his side of the deal, i.e. trim to 7'. However I don't want him to be out of pocket. The difference between his original quote and the new one I have just received is only £25. I think offering the lad this much would be a bit of an insult and I'm not sure it would even cover his costs of disposing the rubbish. He said that the rubbish disposal was £50, bit of a round number, but I think this is what I will probably offer him.
  • rxbren
    rxbren Posts: 413 Forumite
    what experiance has your neighbour got as ive got some cheap looking tools in the garage although they each cost way in excess £500 each!
    ok he had to borrow a ladder its better he borrowed a ladder from your neighbour rather than having to hire one and charge you extra for it or buy one and offset some of the cost
    im in the same posistion and having to buy loads of kit is a massive drain on finances and for him to buy a larger ladder just for one job which he may not need again is a waste of money
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