Refused a ticket on the train this morning

Clam_Abuse_2

Morning,

I took my usual trip this morning on Virgin between Preston and Lancaster.

As usual, the conductor came round and I asked him for a return ticket to Lancaster. He refused me and said that you cannot get a return ticket on a train.

I asked 'since when' and he told me for the last two years they haven't issued return tickets on a train.

I have two questions;

1 - Do have a point?

2 - Who have I been handing my money over to for the last two years?

posh_scouse

Clam_Abuse wrote: »

Morning,

I took my usual trip this morning on Virgin between Preston and Lancaster.

As usual, the conductor came round and I asked him for a return ticket to Lancaster. He refused me and said that you cannot get a return ticket on a train.

I asked 'since when' and he told me for the last two years they haven't issued return tickets on a train.

I have two questions;

1 - Do have a point?

2 - Who have I been handing my money over to for the last two years?

Officially they can only sell you an full open single on the train if you had the opportunity to buy before you boarded - ticket office or machine

They can offer discretion and sell you a return but they don't have to

Clam_Abuse_2

posh_scouse wrote: »

Officially they can only sell you an full open single on the train if you had the opportunity to buy before you boarded - ticket office or machine

They can offer discretion and sell you a return but they don't have to

So he was been awkward.

The little scrote.

Cheers, PS.

pinkteapot

And the reason you can't buy a ticket before you travel like everyone else is.....?

TrickyWicky

Doesn't sound like he was being awkward at all to me. If thats the official rule then thats the rule. Sounds to me like you're the one who has been taking the mick by not wanting to queue for a ticket at the ticket office and holding up the conductor from doing his job - inspecting.

If you're going to try complaining against him then you won't get far arguing that when there is a rule in place that they don't have to sell you a return ticket.

dggar

Running time between Preston and Lacaster is about 15mins according to the National Rail site.

What happens if the conductor does not get to the coach you are in during that time. I trust you go straight to the ticket office at the station where you are getting off and purchase the correct ticket.

When First take over the West Coast they intend installing ticket barriers at Preston and Lancaster.

spiro

Don't know what rule First will operate on this route but for the Hull services it states:

Buying tickets
Ticket types which do not require advance purchase may be obtained on board any of our trains from the Train Manager. In this circumstance it is your responsibility to approach a member of staff to make the purchase as soon as possible after boarding.

You are responsible for finding someone to pay. It does not say what happens if you dont but I guess they could suspect you of fare evasion. Sounds like you need to start buying your tickets before you travel, possibly the day before.

Clam_Abuse_2

TrickyWicky wrote: »

Doesn't sound like he was being awkward at all to me. If thats the official rule then thats the rule. Sounds to me like you're the one who has been taking the mick by not wanting to queue for a ticket at the ticket office and holding up the conductor from doing his job - inspecting.

If you're going to try complaining against him then you won't get far arguing that when there is a rule in place that they don't have to sell you a return ticket.

The bus I get gets to the station about 3 minutes before the train leaves. If I queue up, you bet your last dollar the person in front will take ages.

Taking the mick? Strange how every conductor I've ever met in has not had the same problem.

dggar wrote: »

Running time between Preston and Lacaster is about 15mins according to the National Rail site.

What happens if the conductor does not get to the coach you are in during that time. I trust you go straight to the ticket office at the station where you are getting off and purchase the correct ticket.

If this does happen, and in all my years travelling it has about three or four times, I buy a ticket on the return journey anyway.

spiro wrote: »

Don't know what rule First will operate on this route but for the Hull services it states:

Buying tickets
Ticket types which do not require advance purchase may be obtained on board any of our trains from the Train Manager. In this circumstance it is your responsibility to approach a member of staff to make the purchase as soon as possible after boarding.

You are responsible for finding someone to pay. It does not say what happens if you dont but I guess they could suspect you of fare evasion. Sounds like you need to start buying your tickets before you travel, possibly the day before.

Sounds fair and was exactly what I tried to do.


Honestly, what has it come to when you have to go through reams of literature before using public transport?

TrickyWicky

Clam_Abuse wrote: »

Honestly, what has it come to when you have to go through reams of literature before using public transport?

I disagree with your attitude that you have the right to buy a ticket on board but in fairness to you and in your defence, the point I've quoted you saying is a very good one.

You don't have to read up tons of stuff to use a bus or a taxi so why are the railways so different?

rev_henry

That is the official policy, but the conductors are usually friendly and will sell you whatever. Unfortunately you encountered one of the officious ones. If we're going down the route of berating you for it then what's wrong with the ticket machines at Preston?

Owain_Moneysaver

posh_scouse wrote: »

Officially they can only sell you an full open single on the train if you had the opportunity to buy before you boarded - ticket office or machine

They can offer discretion and sell you a return but they don't have to

The National Rail Conditions of Carriage say:

2. Requirement to hold a ticket
If you travel in a train
(a) without a ticket; ...
you will be liable to pay the full single fare or full return fare or, if appropriate, a Penalty Fare (see Condition 4) for your journey.

If it is a return journey you are liable, and entitled to pay, the return fare. There is no liability in the NRCOC to pay 2 x single fares for a return journey.

The conductor is wrong to refuse to sell you a return ticket.

An individual train operating company cannot impose conditions that are more restrictive than the NRCOC.