Sainsburys flouting consumer rights

RobinXe

arcon5 wrote: »

As for op.... you seem to have done everything correctly. The only thing I would be concerned about it the fact the letter has been sent to them internationally...

I would be surprised if they ignored your LBA. Personally I would resend it once back in the UK (when will that be?) but give them 7 or 14 days instead of 28 days to respond before filing a claim...

Yeah, my concern was the international aspect as well, although BFPO have never let me down yet. It was only their reply that was subject to this method of postage, my LBA was printed and posted on my behalf in the UK. Additionally, I am concerned that since it was posted conventional 1st Class, and not signed-for delivery, that they may opt to ignore it and claim it was not served.

I should be back in the UK by the start of next week, and it is my intention to give them one more opportunity to engage via a chaser, with original LBA enclosed, sent recorded delivery, and with a one week deadline to acknowledge receipt (I appreciate that it will have been signed for, but I wouldn't be surprised if they receive a volume of mail that results in some delay in it being opened).

I would also be surprised if they ignored an LBA, since the courts take a dim view of their time being wasted by parties unwilling to seek alternative remedy.

RobinXe

neilmcl wrote: »

I wouldn't worry too much about an S75 claim either.

Hi neil, just wondering, by this do you mean that you wouldn't consider it an avenue worth pursuing, or that I shouldn't feel any compunction about taking this route with the credit card company.

mattyprice4004

sithmaster wrote: »

i am no expert but i think they are correct as you purchased the item and 16 months it fails, the item is faulty now but was it when you purchased it? if so could be very hard to prove as you had no complains with the item untill 16 months later.
Your best bet would be to contact the manufacture

No. The rights are with the retailer and NOT the manufacturer!

You have the report, Sainsbury's now need to act upon it and provide a remedy. They're entitled to repair, replace or refund at their option - but as you have a report stating it's component failure and it's not you're fault, they have to rectify the fault

neilmcl

RobinXe wrote: »

Hi neil, just wondering, by this do you mean that you wouldn't consider it an avenue worth pursuing, or that I shouldn't feel any compunction about taking this route with the credit card company.

The latter.

arcon5

RobinXe wrote: »

Yeah, my concern was the international aspect as well, although BFPO have never let me down yet. It was only their reply that was subject to this method of postage, my LBA was printed and posted on my behalf in the UK. Additionally, I am concerned that since it was posted conventional 1st Class, and not signed-for delivery, that they may opt to ignore it and claim it was not served.

I should be back in the UK by the start of next week, and it is my intention to give them one more opportunity to engage via a chaser, with original LBA enclosed, sent recorded delivery, and with a one week deadline to acknowledge receipt (I appreciate that it will have been signed for, but I wouldn't be surprised if they receive a volume of mail that results in some delay in it being opened).

I would also be surprised if they ignored an LBA, since the courts take a dim view of their time being wasted by parties unwilling to seek alternative remedy.

Do you have proof of postage? If it was sent 1st class I believe the courts consider it served.

RobinXe

arcon5 wrote: »

Do you have proof of postage? If it was sent 1st class I believe the courts consider it served.

No, unfortunately, it didn't occur to me at the time. To be honest, I thought that as soon as someone who was not a Customer Services phone-jockey got sight of the problem they'd get it sorted, didn't even think that they might play silly b*ggers.

It's a shame, I'd have liked to have come home to a TV, I've got a Sky+ box no doubt overfull of series linked stuff, and no way to watch it! I must've watched every movie on our welfare media player out here a dozen times at least, was looking forward to some new material!

magsmorris

Hi a friend and her husband had a similar problem (tv was only 14 months old but bought from Argos) and hubby decided he was taking it all the way but trading standards told them that 12 months is seen as a reasonable time for a tv to last and to make matters worse their tv was over £1000 it may end up costing you more to get no where sorry for your luck

RobinXe wrote: »

Good morning all, I thought I would post a little about the current situation I have ongoing with Sainsburys in order to see if anyone had any tips or advice, and perhaps to serve as a salutary warning about the risks of doing business with them.

(Scroll to the bottom for TL;DR)

In January 2011 I purchased a Panasonic plasma television from Sainsburys Online for £629. This was, of course, the best price I could find for it, though not by a huge margin, and it was for a brand new item. The vendor provides a 1 year warranty.

In May 2012 the picture on the television started to flicker. This problem got worse over time, and progressed by June to the TV turning itself off, with the '7 flashes' issue, in which I am now well versed, indicating a failure of some of the internal components.

At this point I called Sainsburys customer service to report the problem. Of course the first response I got was "out of warranty, not our problem". After patiently and politely explaining to the representative that it was, in fact and law, still their problem they revealed that they were actually better versed in the SOGA than they were letting on, by insisting that I would have to provide an engineer's report to show that the issue was inherent to the TV and not caused by my negligence or misuse.

I duly lugged my TV to the nearest authorised Panasonic engineer, and paid £60 to obtain a report which indicated a failure of internal components which I have subsequently learned fail with some frequency in this range of TV. The cost of repair is quoted at £316.54.

Ultimately, I would prefer to have a refund for the TV, even if it is slightly abated, since research into the fault has not left me with confidence that it would not reoccur, and thus leave me either significantly out of pocket, or going through this rigmarole all over again!

Having provided Sainsburys with the report, they stalled a while, though I did receive a couple of phone calls to let me know they were still looking in to the matter, before finally receiving an email stating that their 'Investigations Team' had deemed that I would need to get the manufacturer to sort the issue, as it was outside of warranty! :mad:

Thus, I duly drafted a 'letter before court action', citing insufficient quality as grounds for breach of contract under the Sale of Goods Act, which I mailed to their head office on 10th July, with fair warning that after 28 days without a response they could expect a filing in the county court.

I have received no response to this to date which, even allowing for the increased time for post to arrive at an overseas BFPO address, indicates to me that they are simply ignoring the issue in the hope that I will go away. For a £629 TV that only worked for 16 months this is certainly not going to happen!

My intended next step is to write once more on my return to the UK, in order to give them the benefit of the doubt that their mail may have been waylaid between the UK and Afghanistan, after which I will file a claim with the courts.

I am also minded to pursue the S75 route, as I paid for the TV on credit card, though I do have reservations: Firstly and foremost, while I understand that the credit company ARE equally liable, it does not sit well with my sense of fairness, especially given that the trader in question is still very much solvent and trading! Has anyone made a S75 claim under similar circumstances? Does anyone know if the credit company would be willing to assist in my claim against Sainsburys, rather than face the bill themselves?

I'd be very interested to hear from anyone who has experience of similar situations.

TL;DR: Bought a £629 plasma TV from Sainsburys Online in Jan 2011 and paid by credit card. 16 months after purchase the TV failed, and the vendor is claiming that I must approach the manufacturer for a remedy. I have an engineer's report that the fault is due to premature component failure and not misuse, and I would prefer a refund, but would consider repair.

RobinXe

magsmorris wrote: »

Hi a friend and her husband had a similar problem (tv was only 14 months old but bought from Argos) and hubby decided he was taking it all the way but trading standards told them that 12 months is seen as a reasonable time for a tv to last and to make matters worse their tv was over £1000 it may end up costing you more to get no where sorry for your luck

From all the information I can find it sounds like your friends got some pretty poor advice. Will give Trading Standards a call when I am back in the UK and advise you what they say about this.

gregg1

yangptangkipperbang wrote: »

" Sainsburys flouting consumer rights"

A grossly misleading heading.

Sainsburys are complying 100% with the Law. You seem to think that they should immediately roll over and comply with your demands without your having to comply with the Law yourself.

The Law states that if you can PROVE that there was a defect in design or manufacture then you can claim damages (after 6 months; Sainsburys actually gave you 12 months, I wouldn't call that "flouting" the Law) - that doesn't mean that you are entitled to a new TV or a refund either. There is NO defined "reasonable time" - who is to know that you haven't had the TV switched on 24 hrs a day for the full 16 months ??

You have a right to take proceedings in Court. Sainsburys might contest it, you might decide not to bother, they might decide to settle. The choice is yours

I am all for consumer rights - and have used the Law myself, but I do wish people would, at least, try and understand the Law before making totally unjustified (and incorrect) statements about how a retailer responds.

They are not complying with the law if they are using the excuse that the item is out of warranty or try to fob you off by stating you take it up with the manufacturer. The warranty does not affect your statutory rights under sale of goods act which is that an item should be fit for purpose which this item clearly is not.

somethingcorporate

RobinXe wrote: »

From all the information I can find it sounds like your friends got some pretty poor advice. Will give Trading Standards a call when I am back in the UK and advise you what they say about this.

They evidently been very poorly advised by TS and should have asked here.

I don't see much point in you seeking a second opinion from TS as all you have been told here is correct in regard to the process you are following. Re-send LBA with proof of postage when you are back with 7 day deadline and then file small claims (including adding the cost of your report).

I doubt it would get as far as court with this retailer.