when you reach breaking point

mardatha

Second what Monnagram and GQ said. I was born in 1950, grew up in a brand new council house with one coal fire and no other heating, and I still think to this day that heating in a bedroom is not really needed, unless you have damp. Cold won't kill you - cold and damp will.
I started work in the mid 60s and you could walk out of a job on the Tues, find another one in the paper, and start it on the Thurs. Although the wages wouldn't have paid for more than your bus fares and make-up
I look at my daughter and her big family - and to me they waste a hell of a lot of money.Four kids still living at home, each with a separate bedroom, each with a TV and laptop or computer in it, and the heating on. Tumble drier on every day and the power shower, plus the water heater. Latest smart phones, coffee in a cafe every day and an expensive holiday every year... that to me is ok if you're rich. But she's not. It's debt and struggle and I think life is too short to waste in that kind of stuff. If my own daughter lives like that then how many others do?
I hope to hell we don't go back to the old days when people had to work so hard all their lives to scrape by on a slice of bread & jam - but we have the power in our hands to stop that happening. With everything that's going on I still don't hear anybody opposing the govt ! We all seem to sit and take it and watch the big company profits go higher and higher while we're squeezed harder and harder. So maybe there is more than one lesson being dished out here eh? Apathy gets you what you deserve... maybe instead of turning on each other - like the unions, the sick, the unemployed etc - we should remember that yes, in a way, we are all in it together. ie We the ordinary people who elect the govt and who pay for every bloody thing !

OrkneyStar

westcoastscot wrote: »

From here you sign on by phone/mail, but have a 70 mile round trip each fortnight to meet with the jobsupport folks - they pay bus fares but nothing towards the hours hanging around waiting for the bus back down the road.

We're pretty much at our financial limit and its a huge worry. I always used to say "so long as I have my health we'll be fine" but now I don't - like others I have a degenerative illness. I plan to continue working for as long as I can. I also generate a little income working from home but do fear greatly for my future. Not sure what else we can do but just hang on.

I do know we're more fortunate than a lot of the people I meet through work, but it's getting harder to see.

WCS

Sorry to hear this.
(I was only answering a question that someone asked about signing on by phone a few posts back, at the time I could have afforded a bus fare, DH was working, I and ended up being given approx 2 weeks of cont. based JSA, before getting a job, so mine wasn't an example of hardship, for the record).

GreyQueen

You're bang on there, Mar. Mum was a foster-child and she left school at 15 (she was offered the chance to stay on until 16 but only to re-do the exact same work, not to take any exams or anything. If you didn't make the grammar school, they washed their hands of you).

The bit of money that the council had given Grandma for her keep stopped and they told Grandma exactly how much she had to take of Mum's shopgirl wages for keep and stopped Mum's little bit of state-funded pocket money. As Mum had to ride the train from the village into town that, plus the trainfares, meant she had less money in work than she did in school. She was out of the house from 7 am to 7 pm (train times being inconvenient) and it was devastating to do all that and be so poor.

Women also earned so much less than men that when it came to going out socially, if the man wouldn't/couldn't pay for the girl, she usually couldn't afford to pay for herself. Mum can remember having to get a small transistor radio on tick, they were so expensive compared to what people earned.

Dad was a farm labourer and then switched to labouring on building sites in the 1960s building boom as it paid slightly more. You didn't earn enough to have any form of motor transport so the typical thing was for country boys like him to bike 3-4 miles to a rendezvous point where they'd leave the pushbikes in the hedge and the work van would collect them and take them to the site. And done in reverse at day's end, of course.

They were so desperate for workers that the foreman would come around and ask if they knew anyone who wanted a job? Dad recalls one such incident when a workmate pipped up a name and qualified it by saying the bloke wasn't much good.

Does he have a pulse?! was the desperate foreman's response.

There were a lot of jobs around but they paid an absolute pittance, probably less in real terms of spending power for the week than you'd get for a Saturday-only job now. No way were most young people able to self-support, their income was at pocket-money levels. If you ever find an old newspaper from those times lining a drawer and it's a job page you'll be astonished at how very many ads for workers there were, as well as the trifling wages. I earn more an hour than they earned in a week but inflation hasn't made me a millionairess.:p

Yeah, Mar, think we're going to have to lift our heads up from our own affairs and get active politically. Wouldn't be the first time for me. Can easily see riots in the not too distant future.

Hmmmm, where did I leave my placard and whistle...........?

westcoastscot

Orkney - Please don't be sorry, I was merely adding our experience to the thread - i've been very fortunate never to have had to sign on. Here in my corner of the west coast we're in an unusual geographic situation, in that we have very few services, none of the big supermarkets and have to travel long distances for work, shopping etc. Difficult sometimes but easier to resist the lure of bargain shopping! Monthly shopping is a must, and my children grew up knowing when it was gone it was gone for another month.

My life experience echo's those here, particularly monnogran and GQ - I live in a tiny 3 bed terraced house with my two grown sons - they both work and get paid well but cannot afford to rent or buy locally as prices are vastly inflated by incomers. Social housing isn't available to single people,mostly being taken by those who are vulnerable in some way. One son went away to uni, but returned after 6 years of study to live and work here as work wasn't available to him over on the east coast. It's very cramped here, the rooms are small and we;re a little on top of each other but it's ours, the running costs are relatively small and we manage fine by and large.

This thread has actually cheered my somewhat - monnogran's contribution reminded me that yes, these times are cyclical and we have endured and flourished in much worse circumstances. I too feel that expectations are mostly unrealistic and it will be this that is our downfall in the 21st century unless we address it. I think it's absolutely fine to spend your disposable income on whatever gadgets or items you wish, but the problem lies when peer pressure "forces" those on low incomes to purchase these items and get into debt - it's then a spiral downwards which can take years to recover from. I still do wonder what we can cut down on though to balance our budget in the coming months.

WCS

rhiwfield

COOLTRIKERCHICK wrote: »

Flip it it sound i was blaming you???:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek: NOnoNO.. i mean even though I do panic, I am trying to look atthings from a different Angle... and most of the time where there is a problem, there IS a solution, its just matter of finding/solving it...

Piggies will be arriving in 2 weeks ( going to market on the first friday of the month) so plenty of piggy pics for the daydream thread:D

As for the @sda staff property by all accounts they are only offering 22 hour contracts... ( will carry on this conversation on the other forum)

I have been telling hubby I want more candles, said I wanted to be more romantic:D, but its really to save a bit of leccie;) ( we can normally get very cheap candles through via work

:eek::eek::eek: No!! Wasnt thinking you were blaming me!! Just my clumsy way with words.:o

What I meant to say is that people have every right to be worried at this time.

[Deleted User]

monnagran wrote: »

I don't know if it will comfort anybody but I was born before the war and I've seen all this before. ........ BUT everyone was terrified of nuclear war. I remember the WVS running a 1 in 4 scheme where they set out to train 1 woman in 4 how to survive in the case of a nuclear bomb being dropped........
I remember how to build a 'refuge' room for the family, .........

My point is that every generation seems to have something very difficult to cope with but we have done it all before and we are quite capable of doing it again. The difference being this time that, as I said before, people's expectations are that much higher

I LOVE your post, it is absolutely spot on and says what many of us `oldies` have been trying to say for ages but never got the words right. That bit about building a shelter, oh I remember the stomach churning times, we even made a list of what to put under the stairs as that was our tiny shelter. Time after time of nothing but worry.... but then all of a sudden..... I learned to live for now and I was in my early fifties then and what a life changing moment that was. I carried on being os as that is my very nature but I stopped that dreadful stomach twisting worrying about the future. What will be will be

GreyQueen

WCS my brother (in his forties) lives at our parents' home and always has done apart from a few years away at a college for the disabled. He is almost definately Asperger's; very high functioning and very very clever but not able to handle social interactions and he found it impossible to get work despite a lot of qualifications. Having epilepsy and severe dyspraxia-type issues as well didn't help.:( We watched him being ever more worn down by the endless rejections of signing on and job-hunting for hours everyday and getting nowhere. So scared he'd give up and kill himself.

For the past several years he has been self-employed with a business selling online and claiming no benefits but not making enough from the business to either provide a proper living (hence living with family) or pay tax. However, being able to use his knowledge to earn money gives him a sense of dignity and self-respect which keeps us all sane. Not quite how my parents figured their life would turn out but as Mum says, better to have him slightly-disabled and under her roof than so afflicted that she'd be visiting him in a care home.

There's always someone worse off than ourselves, I find.

Popperwell

mardatha wrote: »

With everything that's going on I still don't hear anybody opposing the govt ! We all seem to sit and take it and watch the big company profits go higher and higher while we're squeezed harder and harder. So maybe there is more than one lesson being dished out here eh? Apathy gets you what you deserve... maybe instead of turning on each other - like the unions, the sick, the unemployed etc - we should remember that yes, in a way, we are all in it together. ie We the ordinary people who elect the govt and who pay for every bloody thing !

I could've quoted all of your post Mar but in the here and now this paragraph says it all. And the parts I have highlighted. I don't see myself as being particularly political but once they start classing practically every disadvantaged member of society as a waster/scrounger my hackles rise.

Yes, I am biased because I'm one of them. But I supported all those you mention in your examples before I was. Of course there are some that work the system but thery really are fewer than the media and politicians suggest and present to the public.

Best part are found out but this means all are "tarred" with the same brush and most who have a "Go" at those who need help do so on anectdotal evidence and a lot of assumptions are made often that are wrong and based on ignorance.

Then again, it's not helped by a lot of misinformation being put out, in many cases deliberately but the constant "Drip, Drip,Drip" does have an affect.

Get talking to people on here and those in the "Street" many do feel the same as us they don't like what is happening, they don't agree with a lot of what is done in our name by the leaders and are struggling, they still care for their nearest and dearest and have the same goals. We are back to the silent majority again.

Most of our lives are simple and if we are lucky though not exciting we ask no more than to be warm, eat reasonably well and have a roof over our heads. Health and happiness for ourselves and loved ones.

Most of us do not and never will live the life that the media often portrays as what most have as and someone on here the other day said(I paraphrase)and you have to some extent...we see the shene where everything looks great and those shown seem to have it all(but scratch the surface and they are in debt)and they have all the worry that goes with it.

Many have no idea what is coming, is that apathy? It is not helped by the lack of information coming from the media. Or the slant they put on many stories...

A few months ago the BBC would have talked of the "Cuts" to welfare now they use the term "Savings" now doesn't that sound different.

lostinrates

GreyQueen wrote: »

Moving out before marriage wasn't done by my parents' generation as we are working-class; labourers and farmworkers and shopworkers. By the time my parents were young, the custom of going away "into (domestic) service" which was the norm for girls in families like ours had died the death. Prior to WW2, all the girls went into service in my family, often in London where they tended to meet the hubbies-to-be.

My Nan was called back from London by her Mum where she was in service from 14-16, just as WW2 broke out. As she changed buses on the last stage of the long journey back to her village, the official broadcast of the declaration of war came out.

Mum was very nearly a WREN but decided not to go for it at the last minute (she passed all the interviews etc and they wanted her) as the only things she would have been doing consituted "skivvying in uniform" as she put it and she wasn't prepared to sign up for that.

I stand by my remark as true for people like my family whose employment didn't offer accomodation and whose wages were far too low to run to even a rented room in shared accomodation. Apart from people who joined the Forces, none of my parents' peers lived away from their parents prior to marriage.

Of course it was true that many did not,move out, but its also true to say that jobs that were not middle class were available with jobs. My dad left school at fourteen and was kicked out of home into work accomodation at fifteen. He had got into grammer school, and the school pleaded with his parents to let him stay on, but my grandfather said that at six foot tall dad was a man, and he wasn't paying to keep another man. That sort of thing happens less now as more parents realise the benefits of education, even if not for earning potential then for personal fulfilment, and i suppose thats an extra financial cost to consider too.

His mother, and they did not come more working class, arrived from ireland in the war. That period of history changed so much. My grandmother at that age would never have nelieved she would be a home owner before the war, let alone ending up very comfortable from pensions accrued. Her husband was a bobby. Second son of second son, of a foundling adopted by farmers. Family were the farmers and workers alike, and new cottages, or houses, depending on the family status, were built to addomodate until planning law stopped that. My grandad wanted nothing to do with the farm (his dad had been both copper and farmworker) and was a bobby, then after the war met gran in london and they decided to stay there as she liked her hospital and he fancied london. That was the best financial move ever. They were in social strata working class, though that strange time lifted there earnings so they could get a house. After grandad died we found out they had a small fortune from living modestly. Granny had alzheimers and this small fortune meant that she could be well taken care of. She was born, typical irish catholic family, one of very many, dirt poor and was not a bright woman, but worked hard to become a nurse, really hard. In fact it was making a choice somewhat opposite to your grandmother's that was the change for her, in 'career' and 'social mobility'.

Another massive way they saved money? They did not divorce. My grandmother was not very happy (though i think he loved her, and she found a sort of security with him). They just would not have considered it. They might have got more finacially comfortable, but they never rose in outlook enough to consider divorce acceptable. Keeping two homes might have made them, in someways happier, but certainly would have impacted on their earnings.

Nowadays i think people are less likely to settle for 'ok'. We know there are more one person households, by fate or choice, and thank good ness people do leave unhappy relationships. But it must have some knock on impact both on personal resources and what is available ion the market.....e.g. Property prices, heating fuel usage etc.

westcoastscot

GreyQueen wrote: »

WCS my brother (in his forties) lives at our parents' home and always has done apart from a few years away at a college for the disabled. He is almost definately Asperger's; very high functioning and very very clever but not able to handle social interactions and he found it impossible to get work despite a lot of qualifications. Having epilepsy and severe dyspraxia-type issues as well didn't help.:( We watched him being ever more worn down by the endless rejections of signing on and job-hunting for hours everyday and getting nowhere. So scared he'd give up and kill himself.

For the past several years he has been self-employed with a business selling online and claiming no benefits but not making enough from the business to either provide a proper living (hence living with family) or pay tax. However, being able to use his knowledge to earn money gives him a sense of dignity and self-respect which keeps us all sane. Not quite how my parents figured their life would turn out but as Mum says, better to have him slightly-disabled and under her roof than so afflicted that she'd be visiting him in a care home.

There's always someone worse off than ourselves, I find.

Very true GQ - my eldest is, we think, high functioning aspergers - was diagnosed at uni but by then he had found ways to cope by and large, as we homeschooled and worked his life around his way of living it. It was quite amusing to look into it with him and hear how astounded he was that we didn't all think the same way! He just couldn't get work though but is reasonably successful in his own business, and happy too which is more important.

Youngest has a serious immune disorder that is in remission and very well controlled by scarey drugs at the mo!!! He's working too but we're trying to build in contingency plans for when he can't.

You never know what life will throw at you do you???? Makes you count your blessings though.

It sounds like your parents have done an excellent job raising you and your brother and I take my hat off too them

WCS