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Distance between spindles in a rented property?
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We rented it because we needed somewhere to live, in a certain area, within a certain time and a certain budget. If we got any fussier we'd be homeless.
They're not fancy spindles so wouldn't cost much to make. I understand they would be relatively simple to fit and not particularly time consuming. Of course "great expense" is relative.
Safety wise the spaces as I say are boarded up so no one can slip through but it doesn't look great. The LL is fine with the makeshift arrangement and the plan to fit spindles ourselves. However what I was wanting to find out is if it would be the LL's responsibility to put them in place, say like it is to have a smoke alarm fitted.
If the LL were to do what the last poster suggested re: serving a section 21 then obviously that's their prerogative. To me that is a pretty extreme reaction but if the LL is quite happy to lose a tenant with a faultless history of paying rent in full on time and returning properties in good condition over fitting some spindles then I'd be be happier living elsewhere with a reasonable LL tbh.0 -
jess-the-cat wrote: »We rented it because we needed somewhere to live, in a certain area, within a certain time and a certain budget. If we got any fussier we'd be homeless.
They're not fancy spindles so wouldn't cost much to make. I understand they would be relatively simple to fit and not particularly time consuming. Of course "great expense" is relative.
Safety wise the spaces as I say are boarded up so no one can slip through but it doesn't look great. The LL is fine with the makeshift arrangement and the plan to fit spindles ourselves. However what I was wanting to find out is if it would be the LL's responsibility to put them in place, say like it is to have a smoke alarm fitted.
If the LL were to do what the last poster suggested re: serving a section 21 then obviously that's their prerogative. To me that is a pretty extreme reaction but if the LL is quite happy to lose a tenant with a faultless history of paying rent in full on time and returning properties in good condition over fitting some spindles then I'd be be happier living elsewhere with a reasonable LL tbh.
Just for the record, there is no obligation on a landlord to have a smoke alarm fitted.
Really, this is a matter of cost and looks. If this is going to cost the LL say a week's rent to put right, he would be foolish to lose good tenants for that. If it's a few months' worth of rent, you would understand why this would be uneconomic for the LL. I was assuming it might be quite a big job, and you are assuming it's a tiny one. Of course, neither of us knows, and we are really just arguing at cross purposes because we don't know the cost.No reliance should be placed on the above! Absolutely none, do you hear?0 -
The regulation you are thinking of is based on Part K of the Building Regulation requirement. However, building regulations are not retrospective and if the property was constructed prior to them coming into force, then this won't apply.
Yes, quite, which was why I said it would depend on when it was built. It would have to comply with the Regs in force at the time.
We built our own house back in 1987, at that time the Regs here in Scotland would have required a max spacing of 100mm.0 -
No legal requirement for a smoke alarm (except in an HMO).
No legal requirement for minimum spacing in bannisters other than Building Regs at the time of construction (or repalcement of stairs) as explained above.
More general H&S requirements may be relevant but you'd need an inspection by HSE to determine this.
If the LL is happy for you to install new spindles, to a matching or otherwise acceptable design, the that seems an easy solution (but get his agreement in writing).
If he's willing to bear the cost himself, all the better for you, but I doubt you can force this without a longwinded battle and H&S report etc.
By which time he'll be very p*ssed off and terminating your tenancy (how long is your ficed term?)0 -
No legal requirement for a smoke alarm (except in an HMO).
No legal requirement for minimum spacing in bannisters other than Building Regs at the time of construction (or repalcement of stairs) as explained above.
More general H&S requirements may be relevant but you'd need an inspection by HSE to determine this.
If the LL is happy for you to install new spindles, to a matching or otherwise acceptable design, the that seems an easy solution (but get his agreement in writing).
If he's willing to bear the cost himself, all the better for you, but I doubt you can force this without a longwinded battle and H&S report etc.
By which time he'll be very p*ssed off and terminating your tenancy (how long is your ficed term?)
Not as p*ssed off as he will be if he faces a negligence claim should a child be injured as a result of the missing spindles.0 -
OTOH, if the safety standard is different because the current tenants have small children, the obvious solution for the LL is to fix some planks temporarily to keep the kids safe for the time being, then serve a S21 notice to quit at the earliest opportunity. As you say, that's business.
Safety requirements are safety requirements. What you are suggesting is discrimination.
You can't pick and choose which safety requirements you will undertake as a business, if you don't also make the customer aware.
Of course, the landlord could serve a section 21...but all that's stating is how stupid and bias the system is.
In the meantime, the landlord has to fulfill safety requirements (and were not sure this is one on this particular house). He/She can't pick and choose which part of safety requirements they would like to adhere by.0 -
Graham_Devon wrote: »Safety requirements are safety requirements. What you are suggesting is discrimination.
You can't pick and choose which safety requirements you will undertake as a business, if you don't also make the customer aware.
Of course, the landlord could serve a section 21...but all that's stating is how stupid and bias the system is.
In the meantime, the landlord has to fulfill safety requirements (and were not sure this is one on this particular house). He/She can't pick and choose which part of safety requirements they would like to adhere by.
But Graham, everyone agrees that the LL should meet statutory safety requirements.No reliance should be placed on the above! Absolutely none, do you hear?0 -
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Graham_Devon wrote: »So absolutely no concern for the family you rent out to then?
The children are not in danger - it's just a matter of aesthetics.No reliance should be placed on the above! Absolutely none, do you hear?0 -
The children are not in danger - it's just a matter of aesthetics.
The children are in danger (not high risk). There is a reason for the spacing on spindles to hit certain widths in new builds.
Children can get stuck in between spindles. They can fall through them.
Spindles are not purely aesthetic. They are a safety feature. All that I'm saying here, is that if the house should have a certain max width between them, then that's what the landlord should be responsible for providing before renting their house out.
We went through this at work not long back and had to alter the banister, as it didn't meet health and safety requirements and it's a space inviting the public in.0
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