Does Your Child Go To A Proper School Or An Academy?

Welshwoofs

thegirlintheattic wrote: »

As for your mum's friend, once you have QTS you can teach any subject (legally) but most heads will want someone who has at least a grasp of what they are teaching. I'd be very concerned about the children this friend is teaching, how can you teach French if you cannot speak it?! Sign of a very poor school IMHO.

Exactly - I'd also be concerned about kids being taught French by someone who can't speak French. I'd have thought it'd be preferable to shuttle in a vocational French teacher (who may not have a PGCE or the QTS).

So I guess that's my point. As it stands, we have some failing schools with poor teachers. They're teachers who tick all the boxes the Op wants, but they're not performing. So what does this mean? Well for a start, for me it means that the on-going evaluation of teachers can't be good enough if the under-performing ones are still around. It also, in my mind, raises questions about how well the QTS actually does assess someone's ability to teach if the poor ones got through in the first place.

I think there's a lot wrong with the education system full stop frankly; from league tables that force schools to spoon-feed pupils to keep their league position up, to exam boards that market on the basis of what's easier to pass. Also what seems to be the casting aside of a 'broad education' with its foundations in the basics to very narrow subject topics that often don't have any particular value to employers (and ultimately, unless the kid is bound for a life in academia, what is attractive to employers should be important!)

suki1001

Actually as per the title of the thread - both!

When I went to the fantastic secondary school, that my dad taught at without a degree, it was a great school.

My dd is now going to this school in september. Speaking to my old maths teacher who was brilliant and helps support the newer teachers there, it is now an academy (although they don't call themselves that) - she says the school is greatly improved, because of the fantastic head, and it was a good school when I went. It is so highly spoken of that I haven't heard a bad word said against it. Considering it is such a big school I think that's fantastic. I trust them to employ the right people to teach my dd.

Going round the school during an open evening - listening to an exciting conversation my dd was having about the books she had read and the books they were doing at school with her new English teacher - both of them totally enthusiastic gave me confidence that the school knew what it was doing when it employed people. I would have every faith they employed people on their knowledge and ability to teach, rather than a piece of paper.

puddy

Janepig wrote: »

I write Court reports for a living, and use (or try to use ) correct spelling, grammar, etc... for them and in every other aspect of my communication, including text messages, anal old me, despite only having 3 GCSE's to my name (I was in the first year that took GCSE's). I also present and read Court reports prepared by colleagues, the vast majority of whom have degrees, and they are appalling. Grammar is terrible, spelling awful, sentence structure awful, and I'm surprised there aren't more complaints.

Our new receptionist where I work has a law degree, such are the numbers of people with degrees out there now, it's hard to sort the wheat from the chaff. I've been with the same employer for 20 years and there's only afew of us left now who haven't got degrees. If I'd left after having my children instead of going back after maternity leave, I'd never get back in there now. Doesn't mean the staff are any better, in fact, they've probably got worse over the years, but on paper they're better qualified.

Jx

i would never present anything that isnt perfect. i touch type at quite at speed, usually whilst i have an eye on the telly or something else so just type as it comes into my mind without having to stop for this. however work reports are different, its like texting, do you spell everything fully on a text or use abbreviations? i cut things down as short as poss

GobbledyGook

Any school that turns into an Academy is going to need bums on seats to access funding so if they stop giving out good results they'll not get bums on seats.

The qualified teacher debate has been going for years, it's just now that it's coming into the state system. I personally don't think it'll make a huge deal of difference. There will still be people teaching in schools who shouldn't be - qualifications won't make a difference to that. It'll mean that some of the people working as classroom assistants who do some/part of the teaching when they are paired with poor teachers will be able to be recognised for the work that they do.

There is a woman who works in a nursery attached to a school I used to work in. She's a maths whizz. She helps the Head set extra work for the G&T kids in maths. She would love to be a teacher, but she can't afford to go back to uni to do her years teaching course and there are so many "proper" teachers she'd never get a job round here unqualified. I'd love to have her teaching my kids. At the same time there is a young teacher who came into the school with outstanding academic achievements. She was fantastic in interview and has lots of brilliant ideas. Sadly she has zero ability at dealing with a class. She's rubbish at the basic fundamental part of being a teacher. Yet she's a "proper" teacher.

DecentLivingWage

It's not up to us to decide really.... most young parents nowadays want the very best qualified teachers for their kids and they will be the ones deciding not only on which school is best for their child but also which government they will choose. Things have moved on and young assertive parents won't accept second rate schools or second rate staff babysitting their children when they should be learning. However, it's the trusting, less well-educated parents I worry for.... that's why I will keep recommendiing that they ask lots of questions all of the time - from mp s, schools, governors etc.

GobbledyGook

DecentLivingWage wrote: »

It's not up to us to decide really.... most young parents nowadays want the very best qualified teachers for their kids and they will be the ones deciding not only on which school is best for their child but also which government they will choose. Things have moved on and young assertive parents won't accept second rate schools or second rate staff babysitting their children when they should be learning. However, it's the trusting, less well-educated parents I worry for.... that's why I will keep recommendiing that they ask lots of questions all of the time - from mp s, schools, governors etc.

Well as a young (I think I still count as young - I still feel young!) parent I want the best teachers for my children. Their paper qualifications are not the important thing.

In many ways it may be a good thing. It may make parents ask more questions and observe teachers more rather than, as many, many, many parents do assume that because a teacher is qualified means they automatically know better.

Parents should be demanding good standards of teaching for their children. However, demanding only teachers with certain qualifications is incredibly short sighted.

pollypenny

As a matter of interest, what is your subject, OP?

Surely, punctuation and spelling is crucial and automatic for anyone who has to write a good deal. I'm surprised that a teacher could happily post such errors.

( Says she who has a daily typo) However, there is a vast difference between typos and a cavalier attitude to the conventions of language.)

peachyprice

DecentLivingWage wrote: »

It's the trusting, less well-educated parents I worry for.... that's why I will keep recommendiing that they ask lots of questions all of the time - from mp s, schools, governors etc.

You're not just recommending they ask questions though, are you. You're scaremongering, telling them that children attending Academies will be babysat by unqualified teachers and people will move out of the area to avoid sending their children to previously good schools just because they've adopted an academy status. Telling them that unless they're wealthy they will be getting a second rate education. Which is all a far cry from the truth really, isn't it.

The very title of this thread says it all, academy or 'proper school' as if those less-educated, trusting parents you're so concerned for have already made a grave mistake by choosing a school that it an academy.

Acc72

DecentLivingWage wrote: »

I will keep recommendiing that they ask lots of questions all of the time - from mp s, schools, governors etc.

Hi OP - you may recommend that people ask lots of questions, but it is clear by your lack of response to the points raised that you are not so keen on answering questions.

You are making the assumption that an academy will use the lowest paid staff in order to save money (using "Joe Blogs off the dole" as it was referred to earlier).

However, you are missing the key point that the academy will only continue to receive funding if they achieve results (unlike now).

In order to do this they will have to employ the best teachers, which will benefit the pupils.

What is it exactly you are afraid of ?

thegirlintheattic

GobbledyGook wrote: »

Any school that turns into an Academy is going to need bums on seats to access funding so if they stop giving out good results they'll not get bums on seats.

The qualified teacher debate has been going for years, it's just now that it's coming into the state system. I personally don't think it'll make a huge deal of difference. There will still be people teaching in schools who shouldn't be - qualifications won't make a difference to that. It'll mean that some of the people working as classroom assistants who do some/part of the teaching when they are paired with poor teachers will be able to be recognised for the work that they do.

There is a woman who works in a nursery attached to a school I used to work in. She's a maths whizz. She helps the Head set extra work for the G&T kids in maths. She would love to be a teacher, but she can't afford to go back to uni to do her years teaching course and there are so many "proper" teachers she'd never get a job round here unqualified. I'd love to have her teaching my kids. At the same time there is a young teacher who came into the school with outstanding academic achievements. She was fantastic in interview and has lots of brilliant ideas. Sadly she has zero ability at dealing with a class. She's rubbish at the basic fundamental part of being a teacher. Yet she's a "proper" teacher.

Maybe you should suggest to this woman she follows the GTP route; I'm surprised the school has not already approached her about this if she is so good and keen to be a teacher. Through that route you get paid whilst you get QTS by working in your school.