Bought dogs with contract now seller is messing me around

peeper

Hi

I am trying to find out if I am considered the legal owner of 2 dogs that I recently bought.
I'll try to keep this as short as possible.

2 1/2 weeks ago, I bought 2 pedigree kennel club registered dogs from a lady who could no longer look after them. The RSPCA were after her as she had moved out of her filthy flat and left the dogs behind, locked in a cage and only returned once per day to let them out and feed them.
I attended the lady's home address and we signed a sale of dog contract for the 2 dogs, with her as the seller, me as the purchaser.
However the lady said she had lost the paperwork for the girl so it was agreed that I would pay £1000 at that time of the purchase, and a further £1000 when she forwarded me the kennel club registration, which would allow me to transfer the dog into my name with the Kennel Club, which is necessary for me to be able to register any offspring she may have. This agreement was entered by hand onto the contract and we both signed underneath.
This agreement was also recorded verbally on my phone.
It was also in the contract that the lady was to be given a puppy back from the dogs first litter for free.

I ordered and paid for a duplicate registration document for the girl to be sent to the lady who is now refusing to forward it to me. I now believe that she had never lost the original registration document, but she had deliberately retained it.

I do believe that she is now going to claim that the dogs still belong to her. I have been informed that she is now trying to sell the girl to other parties too.

I need to know if I legally own the dogs? They are currently in my possession and the boy is registered under my name with the kennel club now but not the girl. As with a car tho, the registered owner is not necessarily the legal owner with regards to the Kennel club registration.
I have repeatedly offered her the remaining £1000 for the document but all my e-mails, call's and messages go unanswered. "Her boyfriend has informed me that they are getting the contract checked out!

Does this lady have any legal right or control over the dogs? Does she have any claim to them now? Is she able to ignore the contract?
Am I legally able to make decisions for these dogs, like spay/neuter/rehoming?
If she doesn't give me the document do I have to give her a puppy or the money?

Please help:(

paddyrg

She sounds like a piece of work if she was intentionally cruel in the first place, and that probably tells you all you need to know about her as a person. Why on earth you'd let her have a puppy back when she doesn't appear fit and proper to keep animals is a mystery to me, personally.

But this isn't about my feelings! You need to sue her if you can't work thing out outside the courts. The official certificate/log book may be the official proof of ownership, but cannot be the only one (even DVLA let you replace documents), and in your place I would call the Kennel Club pronto and ask for advice. Maybe the girl is actually a stolen/unregistered mongrel, or a ringer? Maybe the woman runs this sale regularly to sell unregistered dogs for a grand a time? The Kennel Club can give you more iinfo, or info on dog-based lawyers.

arcon5

Did you get a receipt for your initial payment?

If you have both dogs and a receipt or such then this should be sufficient in proving you purchased the dogs, a contract has been entered into and they belong to you.

You owe her some money, imo all she can realistically do is keep trying to pay her in exchange for the document. IMO all she can do at this point is attempt to collect this money but as long as you can demonstrate your efforts then she doesn't have a very good case.

Elle7

Before you paid for the dogs, did you check that they are actually registered? Stolen or forged certificates are hugely common. Did you also check that the girl can still be bred - the KC can put restrictions on breeding that would prevent you from registering future puppies.

Are the dogs microchipped? This is potentially a lot more complicated than just the kennel club paperwork.

What is concerning is that you have rescued two neglected dogs - and now plan on breeding them, and giving a puppy back to the very person who neglected them in the first place.

What breed are the dogs? How old are they? Have they been fully health tested? There are common scams around pairs of dogs who are sold as KC reg but actually aren't, or have failed health tests so produce unhealthy puppies that are very hard to sell, or have already had too many litters.

The whole story seems unusual, because KC dogs are expensive, so why would you buy two and neglect them? You could potentially sell them for a lot more than she did, depending on the breed, so if you got a "bargain" that's even more concerning.

Have you had them checked out at the vet? I'm sure you already know, but incase you are new to breeding, being looked over at the vets is not the same as the health tests that need to be done before breeding. These tests include hip tests, eye tests and genetic tests, depending on breed.

I hope this helps.

vax2002

You have paid £1000 on trust ?
Is this correct ?

If so you have just discovered, that you can not trust her.
You have been scammed...

At least you have the Dogs.

Oliver14

What breed are they?

PollyOnAMission

PLEASE do not give this woman a puppy if you breed And please think very carefully before breeding. I echo what others have said about health tests etc. If done right (and ethically), you would be unlikely to make a profit.

I'm also very intrigued as to what breed these dogs may be, if they are worth £1000 each in circumstances such as this.

ali-t

Dogs are classed as possessions so your first point of call should be the citizens advice bureau for advice. Good luck, she sounds like a total nightmare.

peeper

Yes all vet checks have been undertaken, by two independent vets since the dogs have been in my care.
The dogs are also correct within the breed standard, are of show quality and I an not new to showing or breeding. They are worth the money I paid and I wanted to pay more so a puppy was not part of the contract. However this offer was refused.
A puppy will not be allowed back to that address until the seller has grown up and changed her ways.
A contract was signed so that is the receipt.

All other paperwork, microchips, import docs etc are in my custody so that is not an issue.

I'm sorry if it's a short reply as I have to leave, i'll be back on later

eeeeeee

please read the pm i have just sent you ... i take it that these dogs are high end in price .... such as pug , or french bulldog ?
out of curiosity did you buy them off of preloved ?
only that there is a spat between someone on preloved who sold a dog and a !!!!! ; then buyer no1 put them back up for sale within hours of takeing them home too sell for more money! and successfully selling on the pair too buyer no2... the original seller has made an annoucement that keeps getting removed from preloved forum and for sale section ... that she wont be giving buyer no the paperwork for the !!!!! unless she pays her the extra money !... might be related too you might be not ...dispute relates too fawn black masked french bulldogs.....=!!!!! =female dog

Oliver14

Elle7 wrote: »

because KC dogs are expensive, .

Not all KC registered dogs are incredibly expensive it can depend on the breed. You'll find that a lot of so called designer breeds (Non KC registered labradoodles etc) will be far more money than any KC registered dog as that is what they are bred for money making.

I do fine it interesting OP wont tell us the breed of the dogs even though a couple of people have asked.