HMRC PAYE end of year late return fine

Eliza_2

I've had a letter asking for a £100 fine for late submission of the end of year return. I thought I'd submitted it through the PAYE tools system but think I must have just done the test submission although I received an acknowledhment. I immediately submitted the right version as soon as I had a reminder from them earlier this month. I also received an acknowledgment and see it is exactly the same as the test one, which is probably why it confused me. I've never done this before so all new to me.

The fines letter talks about appeals etc - I've looked at HMRC1 which is where they've referred me but I don't know what the grounds might be. Has anyone appealed this fine and can give me any hints? I only paid around £160 in tax through this in the year so this fine is over half of that again. I'm distraught about it and don't know how I can pay it by July14.

Any help will really be good. Thank you.

Wywth

Eliza wrote: »

I've had a letter asking for a £100 fine for late submission of the end of year return. I thought I'd submitted it through the PAYE tools system but think I must have just done the test submission although I received an acknowledhment. I immediately submitted the right version as soon as I had a reminder from them earlier this month. I also received an acknowledgment and see it is exactly the same as the test one, which is probably why it confused me. I've never done this before so all new to me.

The fines letter talks about appeals etc - I've looked at HMRC1 which is where they've referred me but I don't know what the grounds might be. Has anyone appealed this fine and can give me any hints? I only paid around £160 in tax through this in the year so this fine is over half of that again. I'm distraught about it and don't know how I can pay it by July14.

Any help will really be good. Thank you.

Might be better to just pay the £100 and stop worrying any more, especially if you don't have any good reason for appealing.

Unfortunately. thinking you did it right when you didn't, and being new to all this, won't be an acceptable reason for a successful appeal.

Next year, ensure they are done asap, and double check using HMRC online to ensure they were actually submitted correctly.

If, as you claim, you can't muster £100 in the next two weeks, you may want to consider the whole viability of the business you are attempting to run.

Eliza_2

Thank you. It isn't my business, it's a small community organisation. I was the only employee till I left and have been replaced by a volunteer so the organisation needs to de-register from PAYE since then. I wrote to HMRC about this but to date had no response.

The 100 will have to come out of my personal pocket as I was responsible for the return, and whle I appreciate that it was my fault for not knowing that I had sent a test submission rather than the 'real' one, it's going to hit me hard personally.

I don't know whether I have grounds for appeal as I can't find any criteria - that's why I wondered if anyone else has had a similar experience. Thanks.

Wywth

Eliza wrote: »

Thank you. It isn't my business, it's a small community organisation. I was the only employee till I left and have been replaced by a volunteer so the organisation needs to de-register from PAYE since then. I wrote to HMRC about this but to date had no response.

The 100 will have to come out of my personal pocket as I was responsible for the return, and whle I appreciate that it was my fault for not knowing that I had sent a test submission rather than the 'real' one, it's going to hit me hard personally.

I don't know whether I have grounds for appeal as I can't find any criteria - that's why I wondered if anyone else has had a similar experience. Thanks.

With all due respect, if you don't work there anymore, then it's not your responsibility to inform HMRC that the community organisation wishes to de-register for PAYE. As a result, I'm not surprised HMRC have not responded to you over this request.

Leave it to the new incumbant to sort out

Eliza_2

Thanks, the organisation would prefer not to have registered at all - I took it upon myself to register as it was the right thing to do - I so wish I hadn't! I doubt if you asked any of the others if the organisation was registered, they wouldn't have a clue.

The new incumbent won't deal with this, she's a volunteer and not engaged to deal with it.

HMRC are dealing with me over it as there's no one else. Which is why I've got the fines letter!!!

Will ring them on Mon and explain and hope they take pity and give me a bit of time to pay it, after all, as you rightly say, it is my fault.

Wywth

Eliza wrote: »

Thanks, the organisation would prefer not to have registered at all - I took it upon myself to register as it was the right thing to do - I so wish I hadn't! I doubt if you asked any of the others if the organisation was registered, they wouldn't have a clue.

The new incumbent won't deal with this, she's a volunteer and not engaged to deal with it.

HMRC are dealing with me over it as there's no one else. Which is why I've got the fines letter!!!

Will ring them on Mon and explain and hope they take pity and give me a bit of time to pay it, after all, as you rightly say, it is my fault.

If you were employed by the organisation, then the organisation would have had to inform HMRC and enrol under PAYE.
If that was your job at the time, then you were being paid to do so. It was never an option if the organisation were employing you.
If it wasn't your job, but you registered anyway, is that perhaps why you no longer are employed by them? :cool:

Now you have left, the organisation will soon become aware, if they didn't know already where their funds were going, that they were enrolled under the PAYE scheme as soon as HMRC came chasing for the next return, once overdue.

You said you were no longer employed by the organisation and that they now had now secured the services of someone else, albeit on a voluntary basis, to do the work you formally did.

I would leave it up to the organisation to sort out with HMRC, and I am most surprised HMRC would willingly discuss the organisations matters with a former employee of that organisation.

In your previous post you said HMRC had not responded to you over your request to de-register your former employer from the PAYE scheme.

HappyMJ

It isn't a fine it's just a late filing penalty. It's not your responsibility. It is the organization's responsibility. The HMRC do write off penalties so just write them a letter telling them it isn't your problem.

Eliza_2

It was my job, my responsibility to organise these kinds of things on behalf of the organisation whether the board asked me to or not. They don't know about admin stuff - they certainly should but choose not to concern themselves with it. The law said PAYE reg was essential and so I registered.

Although the new volunteer does some of what I did, she wouldn't be responsible for this and there is no longer anyone being paid. (I jumped incidentally, I wasn't pushed!!)

I'll ring on Monday and see how I get on. To be honest, I might just stick it on a credit card just to get rid. I've done almost as much work for this organisation since I left as I did when employed. Just not paid now - my heart sinks when the post comes as every day something comes or emails to do with my previous job, because there's no-one else doing it.

Anyway, grateful to hear that they can write off penalties so hope they do that with me. Thanks

Savvy_Sue

Eliza wrote: »

Just not paid now - my heart sinks when the post comes as every day something comes or emails to do with my previous job, because there's no-one else doing it.

You are no longer employed by the organisation, but you will continue to get such letters for as long as you deal with them. Pass them back to the organisation or return them to the sender: if you're feeling kind you can tell the organisation what needs to be done.

persa

Eliza wrote: »

I've had a letter asking for a £100 fine for late submission of the end of year return. I thought I'd submitted it through the PAYE tools system but think I must have just done the test submission although I received an acknowledhment. I immediately submitted the right version as soon as I had a reminder from them earlier this month. I also received an acknowledgment and see it is exactly the same as the test one, which is probably why it confused me. I've never done this before so all new to me.

The fines letter talks about appeals etc - I've looked at HMRC1 which is where they've referred me but I don't know what the grounds might be. Has anyone appealed this fine and can give me any hints? I only paid around £160 in tax through this in the year so this fine is over half of that again. I'm distraught about it and don't know how I can pay it by July14.

This sounds remarkably like the case of Lifesmart Ltd (TC1832) in which the judge ruled "a genuine and reasonable belief" counted as reasonable excuse under s118(2) TMA 1970.

I'd try making an appeal on that basis, I think you have a good chance of getting the penalty mitigated to zero. But as Sue says, it's really not your problem to sort out.

teneighty

I successfully appealed against a penalty notice a while ago after I made a silly mistake on a return.

The process is very simple, just write and explain about the test submission confusion and explain about the status of the organisation and very low tax due. You may be pleasantly surprised how reasonable they are.

Fingers crossed.