Registering an unregistered electricity supply

chanz4

sacsquacco wrote: »

if seal cut, and replaced to look intact its a good chance of a tamper. the link wire is easily removed to get the meter working again. a record of past occupation and useage would show if bypasses have been used, also scorch marks around the tails are a dead giveaway. the marks can be very light sometimes and not always obvious

Scorch marks would only appear if between 1&4 , if its how I read it that its a dtm at the road. If it has not been done by distrubution they will just send jointers out to disconnect it and it will be estimated how long and how much usage has been used. Its covered under 7/11 of the electricity act.

Inregards to searching ecoes, a supplier can search it to prevent theft as long as its used for this purpose. Not sure if terry has searched on ecoes but if you type a postcode it it shows you the whole street.

chanz4

Terrylw1 wrote: »

If its not confirmed as a tamper, its a pure record issue caused by the distributor.

The ERA code doesn't matte anyway, all parties are bound by the Ofgem policy derived from the Energy patch supercomplaint. This was created to remove the use if statue of limitations for domestic customers.

Theft is a different matter since its a criminal act. A distributor not creating a site is a different matter.

Anyway, if the distributor doesn't know about it...the first thing they will here is a new MPAN request from a chosen supplier. This supplier will not discuss much with them in order to create the record.

The distributor will then only charge the supplier from the 1st settlement date they are registered to it.

The distributor cannot prove when that was installed.

One thing I would be interested in which we haven't heard yet is whether the meter is advancing since the sparky says its connected to the mains. If its advancing, its not a tamper and a site that's never been set up in the distributors MPAS.

This used to happen years ago but the changes in the new connection process prevented it. One shots were often a root cause.

They're rare in elec thesedays.

Thats if it has legally been obtained, which an application for a new supply would be on file.

Terrylw1

chanz4 wrote: »

Thats if it has legally been obtained, which an application for a new supply would be on file.

Given the age of it, its probably one from before deregulation.

Back in 2000, there were so many unregistered supplies that suppliers were instructed to perform mass registrations for anything in their old host region that had no supplier. So, if this customer did ask another one, it was tough really.

This is a bit different though since its not even on the MPAS system, or so we think since the OP is saying the meter can't be found which can easily be something else. Incorrect meter numbers are a regular thing whereas this isn't.

One scenario I didn't think of is a MPAN disconnection, which is a far stricter process these days. It might have been part of a portfolio cleanse and the distributor got it wrong...maybe if they couldn't find the address on Royal Mails end?

The OP needs to give us all some more info I think so we can rule the different scenarios out.

Terrylw1

chanz4 wrote: »

Thats if it has legally been obtained, which an application for a new supply would be on file.

Just as an aside, given P62 modifications years ago, if this happened after that went live and the local distributor had no paperwork, it could be an embedded network...so every distributor would have to check if they did it...messy!

spiro

Given that you have contacted EDF (assume supplier) on a number occasions I would hpone them again and example that an electrician has confirmed it is not a sub meter. They can liaise with the DNO to get an MPAN although they may want to check the installation. As you have contacted them several times (can you prove this) then you may stand a chance of getting the back bill rule to apply as you tried to get them to supply you so you are not hiding the fact you live there and wanted to pay. Sooner you bite the bullet the better.

I know for a fact that whole blocks of flats in London have had meters installed but no MPANs allocated because the meter worked who installed the meters no longer worked for the DNO. The DNO just checked the wiring, allocated MPANs and suppliers starting bill from that date.

catnipmatador

Crikey, thank you for all the helpful replies. I wish I understood more of them.

For those asking for more info, I have checked with both EDF and Networks (?) to see whether they have a record, neither did.

As to whether the installation was installed prior to deregulation, I moved in in 2007 and the property was then just outside the period for needing to make a retrospective application for planning permission on the conversion in two flats. It therefore seems a reasonable bet that the meter went in about 1992. This seems to be confirmed by the London Electrictiy logo on the meter (1990-98)

The meter does appear to work (the numbers do go up and at about the right rate)

What other info would be helpful?

chanz4

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1989/29/schedule/6

Terrylw1

chanz4 wrote: »

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1989/29/schedule/6

But its headed as "Illegally taken" and this customer has moved in since, has a LEB meter which is clearly moving and is trying yo resolve it now since they have learnt that its not submetered or mixing wiring with the other property.

So, for the distributor to claim the elec, they have to prove its an illegal connection. Meter seal tampering though could have been due to some if later work where a sparky can't be bothered to wait on engineers and no isolator switch is fitted. So, it would need more proof than that alone.

For me, this is as Spiro says, we used to see these more years ago and given it looks yo have been done in 1992, its prior to deregulation. The supplier in 2000 for that old region could not register it as the distributor had no "skeleton" record to allow them to do so. Its looks like poor distributor process, so they can pay for their errors, unless someone has pulled an enter service off and fit a meter to it...sent that surely a rare type of tamper though?

In terms of back billing, the supplier cannot attempt to rebill prior to the registration date, and that date has to be registered in the future. The supplier also won't get billed as no consumption is submitted via the Data Aggregator.

Terrylw1

catnipmatador wrote: »

Crikey, thank you for all the helpful replies. I wish I understood more of them.

For those asking for more info, I have checked with both EDF and Networks (?) to see whether they have a record, neither did.

As to whether the installation was installed prior to deregulation, I moved in in 2007 and the property was then just outside the period for needing to make a retrospective application for planning permission on the conversion in two flats. It therefore seems a reasonable bet that the meter went in about 1992. This seems to be confirmed by the London Electrictiy logo on the meter (1990-98)

The meter does appear to work (the numbers do go up and at about the right rate)

What other info would be helpful?

Did the network (distributor) have a record of the meter number anywhere, even if its a different address? And could they find no record of your address at all?

I ask because sometimes addresses get changed in error, so you can't be found.