Advice regarding dementia, theft and POA

carolan78

Sorry in advance if this becomes quite a long post but there's a few different issues I want advice on if anyone is knowledgeable.

My Nan is an 87 year old blind diabetic. She has done amazingly well staying in her own home all these years with only a visit from the community nurse to draw up her insulin. The time has now come though where dementia is talk hold rapidly and she isn't very stable on her legs.

She is currently in hospital (has been there 3 weeks next week) after a minor fall that resulted in some bruising and a bang on the head. They monitored her for the first 2 weeks before doing a mental health assessment (they wanted to make sure her confused state was not increased temporarily due to the bang on the head).

We still do not know the outcome of these assessments, she has been seen by Dr's, psychologists, social workers and occupational health. There is nothing on the ward for her, no tv or radio. She can not read because she is blind and we can see her deteriorating fast due to having nothing to do all day every day. To top it off the ward had a bug and was closed to visitors for 6 days so she is now very scared and talks none stop begging us not to desert her and leave her to live on the streets.

So question 1, when the social workers are back in on Wednesday are we able to explain all of this to them and see if we can get her out of hospital sooner rather than later. Medically she is now find it is mentally she is suffering and hospital is not doing anything to ease that. We have been to visit two nursing homes, both have space for her and we are happy with them both if the social services can get place her there (my Grandmother has no assets so is unable to self fund).

Onto problem number 2 and the theft. With my Nanna in hospital a family member has been acting rather suspicious regarding paper work such as insurance documents, certain bills and bank statements. We found out why when we came across a bank statement shoved down the side of the cooker (we have done a badly needed deep clean of the house with her not there because she won't allow it when she is there). This family member has been taking at the minimum £500 of her benefit money each month. Now we all suspected the family member was borrowing money and not giving it back but we thought it was the odd £20 or £30 here or there nothing on this scale.

They have been taking her bank card (she hasn't gone out anywhere through choice for almost a year) to the other side of the city where they live and making withdrawals there. We know this can not possibly have been for my Nan because another family member draws out what my Nan instructs each week when she does her shopping. The bank card has also been used in a supermarket nowhere near Nans house and it isn't even a supermarket brand she would use (she is set in her ways).

Anyway we know the last thing my Nan would want is this family member getting into trouble so we won't be even trying to go to the authorities, right now we have to consider what is in her best interest. We obviously do not want this situation to continue and as Nan will no doubt be classed as not of sound mind when she is discharged from hospital, does someone need a lasting power of attorney for her financial affairs. I imagine once she is in a nursing home all she will receive will be her pension and other benefits she currently gets will stop.

We are concerned even with just her pension the family member in question will continue to take unless someone else has legally took over dealing with her finances if that makes sense. Also none of us have the £400+ I have read it can cost to put a POA into place, is it possible to get legal aid for this if it is the route we have to go down.

Although Nan is mentally ill she has no new ailments that she didn't have 20 years ago. I can't see her leaving this earth in a hurry and what little money she does have I would rather it was spent on things she can enjoy in her final days here.

agrinnall

Unfortunately you're way too late to get an LPA simply by filling in the forms, your Nan is no longer capable to giving consent to them. You'll therefore need to make an application to the Court of Protection, which I believe will take a few months and could cost quite a lot. You'll need to see a solicitor to do it so I'd try to get a free consultation (perhaps with more than one solicitor) to get an idea of what is involved, how long it will take, and what it will cost.

Edit: Just noticed that you have little money, I doubt if legal aid is available but maybe it's possible for payment to be made from your Nan's income. You definitely need proper legal advice, and while you can get guidance on here it's no substitue for the real thing.

Gingernutty

agrinnall, is correct I'm afraid. The LPA is not an option as your Nan is not 'of sound mind' enough to consent - although if she does have moments of lucidity or is capable of understanding then it might, I stress might just be possible.

The Court of Protection is where you need to go for the Deputyship order - this will take a long time and is generally expensive. However, in certain circumstances, the COP can waive certain fees if the estate to be managed is very small - it sounds like that might be the case in your Nan's case.

The next step would be to get that card shut down - declare it lost and perhaps ask for a new one.

clemmatis

I agree with other posters here on LPA -- sorry. And sorry to hear about all this.

On this, though

So question 1, when the social workers are back in on Wednesday are we able to explain all of this to them and see if we can get her out of hospital sooner rather than later.

of course they don't know what she was like before she entered hospital. And they should know it. And her family should be involved anyway. The next of kin/carer should be able to talk to the social workers, nurses, consultant in charge of her care, and should be involved in any decision. But I know it can be difficult. I suggest you ring AgeUk and the Alzheimer's Society, the 'phone numbers are given here:

http://www.ageuk.org.uk/about-us/who-we-are/useful-addresses-and-numbers/

http://alzheimers.org.uk/site/scripts/documents_info.php?documentID=1761

Tell them about all this. They'll advise you on her and your rights, and on how to approach the social workers etc..

This gives some more information

http://alzheimers.org.uk/site/scripts/documents_info.php?documentID=173


I agree you also need legal advice. Some solicitors do give an hour's advice free.

carolan78

Thank you both I will try speak to the social services at the hospital about it all because any fees are going to be really difficult to get together. The card for now has been removed from where this family member can access it, and her pension is safe and sound for now. It is when she is out of hospital that concerns us.

We'll be checking the card daily to make sure it doesn't get cancelled because tbh none of us are really sure what kind of lengths the family member will go to, to get hold of the cash. They will have basically lost a part time wage.

carolan78

Thank you clemmatis, I am about to head out for an hour or so but will look at those links when I get back. I don't know why I didn't think of them because I phoned them a few months ago for advice on how to get her assessed for dementia because it was becoming glaringly obvious she has it.

dzug1

Gingernutty wrote: »

The next step would be to get that card shut down - declare it lost and perhaps ask for a new one.

That's more difficult than it sounds - the bank should not deal with anyone other than your nana on the subject until a power of attorney/deputyship is in place

Torry_Quine

The one thing I can say is that she will still be entitled to her state pension although most of it will then be payable to the care home. She will be left with personal spending money of approx £22 per week. If in receipt of AA then she would no longer be entitled as the local authority are paying for her care.

dzug1

carolan78 wrote: »

Anyway we know the last thing my Nan would want is this family member getting into trouble so we won't be even trying to go to the authorities, right now we have to consider what is in her best interest. We obviously do not want this situation to continue and as Nan will no doubt be classed as not of sound mind when she is discharged from hospital, does someone need a lasting power of attorney for her financial affairs. I imagine once she is in a nursing home all she will receive will be her pension and other benefits she currently gets will stop.


.

Sorry - this is a difficult issue - but can you be sure that the family member was not doing it with her permission - confused or otherwise? That's what they are likely to claim if challenged and proving anything different will be difficult to say the least. Yes, you may 'know' different but that's not the same thing.

carolan78

Torry_Quine wrote: »

The one thing I can say is that she will still be entitled to her state pension although most of it will then be payable to the care home. She will be left with personal spending money of approx £22 per week. If in receipt of AA then she would no longer be entitled as the local authority are paying for her care.

Thank you I was aware of this already, so I know she will have a lot less than she currently receives. Which I know this family member would take if given the chance.

carolan78

dzug1 wrote: »

Sorry - this is a difficult issue - but can you be sure that the family member was not doing it with her permission - confused or otherwise? That's what they are likely to claim if challenged and proving anything different will be difficult to say the least. Yes, you may 'know' different but that's not the same thing.

We know this is what would be claimed but we have no intention of going to the police or anyone regarding what has happened, purely because we all know my Nan would not want that if she was of sound mind. As above all we want to do is ensure whatever money she receives in the future stays HER money.