Tyre Damage - is it safe to drive

alastairq

Alistairq's posts are starting to sound rather like the people who say "I don't need any security, I've got a Mac and they're infallible" and then promptly connect directly to the internet with no antivirus and no firewall at which point their machine promptly gets owned the first time they visit a scammy website by accident. Meanwhile loads of average people running "crappy, insecure" Windows XP installs with a decent AV, firewall and update notification mechanism manage to survive just fine.

On the contrary.....I don't view your analogy as correct at all....I don't advocate 'doing nothing and hope-for-the-best'.


What I do suggest is ways drivers can make themselves a lot less 'fallible', without resorting to all the drama and hand-wringing so far seen on here.

Even the best of tyres wont save you if you try and rely upon them.

What will save you are proper driving procedures in the first place.....

mikey72

alastairq wrote: »

..........................It may appear like that to a lay-driver...but actually that is exactly what I'm paid to do......have all the answers when required........................................................................................................................I have offered the accepted solutions to the issue you all seem so afraid of...others have perhaps been more eloquent about it....but as I said, take a trip to your local WH Smiths and buy yourselves a copy of 'Roadcraft'...and without cynicism, work through it..............Or..book your selves an IAM or RoSPA advanced course.

I'm afraid you don't appear to have all the answers, and while I can't speak for anyone else, personally, it seems the opposite. I certainly don't need to read roadcraft, or do any advanced courses, I've never had an accident in over thirty years, and that's definitely based purely on my personal skill, some of the cars I'd had probably wouldn't even have been roadworthy at times, let alone without the benefit of branded tyres, and that's at speeds that require more attention than normal.

Lum

alastairq wrote: »

On the contrary.....I don't view your analogy as correct at all....I don't advocate 'doing nothing and hope-for-the-best'.

In my analogy, the quality of the OS in question represents the quality of the driver, and the other software represents the technology used to aid or compensate for that driver.

Thing is. what if this argument were not about quality tyres, but about wearing seatbelts? The perfect driver who can anticipate everything would surely not need to wear a seatbelt.

But I bet you wear one.

And likewise, only an idiot would say "I don't need to worry about driving properly.. I'm wearing a seatbelt!"

Joe_Horner

Lum wrote: »

In my analogy, the quality of the OS in question represents the quality of the driver, and the other software represents the technology used to aid or compensate for that driver.

Thing is. what if this argument were not about quality tyres, but about wearing seatbelts? The perfect driver who can anticipate everything would surely not need to wear a seatbelt.

But I bet you wear one.

And likewise, only an idiot would say "I don't need to worry about driving properly.. I'm wearing a seatbelt!"

Sorry, Lum, gotta take a small issue with you there. I'd much rather not wear a seat belt (concentrates the mind wonderfully you know - one stage towards the old "spike on the wheel" idea ) but I still wear one because it's not worth the eventual fine if I don't

On the other hand, having gone out on a limb and supported a fair bit of what alastairq has been saying I'm not too happy with his dismissal of "no-one but him" getting the point because that suggests that he really does consider himself way out there in front and the only one who understands how to drive safely. Way to alienate any support you might have!

mikey72

Joe_Horner wrote: »

Sorry, Lum, gotta take a small issue with you there. I'd much rather not wear a seat belt (concentrates the mind wonderfully you know - one stage towards the old "spike on the wheel" idea ) but I still wear one because it's not worth the eventual fine if I don't

On the other hand, having gone out on a limb and supported a fair bit of what alastairq has been saying I'm not too happy with his dismissal of "no-one but him" getting the point because that suggests that he really does consider himself way out there in front and the only one who understands how to drive safely. Way to alienate any support you might have!

Do you think he's "got all the answers"?

Joe_Horner

I don't think anyone has all the answers, Mikey.

Well, that's not strictly true - I have but would never be allowed to implement them because it would involve maybe 70% of drivers losing their licences permanently - basically remove all driving laws (except insurance) and have a one strike you're out rule on accidents

Lum

Joe_Horner wrote: »

Sorry, Lum, gotta take a small issue with you there. I'd much rather not wear a seat belt (concentrates the mind wonderfully you know - one stage towards the old "spike on the wheel" idea ) but I still wear one because it's not worth the eventual fine if I don't

I'd rather wear one just in case I do screw up. If you become complacent just because you're wearing a seatbelt (and I accept that some people do) that's a failing on your part.

Oh, and for an example of the unexpected happening, consider this tunnel approach. You're approaching in the outside lane as pictured and about to overtake a slow moving van. Notice the foliage on top of the tunnel entrance where a suitably minded miscreant could hide completely unseen.

This is where I was in 2009, when such a miscreant sprung, dropping a brick from up there straight onto my windscreen leaving me unable to see the left hand lane and with a lovely sliver of glass in one eye and a nice scratch on my glasses from a similar shard making it hard to see ahead.

For bonus points, the van I was overtaking also thought this would be a great time to pull in front of me without looking!

I doubt roadcraft would help in avoiding this situation, but I know I'm glad for the fact that my car was able to brake quickly, without the ABS kicking in, and in a perfectly straight line, giving me one less thing to worry about after that sudden shock.

Bear in mind that I could easily have been blinded by that incident, at which point that quick stop in a straight line, due to the car's technology (aka. proper wheel alignment and good tyres) could have been the difference between life and death, or at least the difference between having a further accident or not.

Joe_Horner

Fair enough with the belts on that basis, Lum, although I'm not 100% sure the ones in my daily would actually do any good in that case. It was designed without them then had them fitted pre-sale because the law changed before it was built and the shoulder mount is too low the way they've done it - so I'd probably just shoot out over the top anyway

As for the bridge, yes the best braking in a case like that is undoubtedly useful but events like that are still so rare that I tend to place them in the "not worth worrying about" category along with being hit by a meteorite or struck by lightning as I walk out the door.

Obviously, if I experienced either of those it would be perfectly reasonable for me to consider wearing a hard hat or conductive suit in the future!

Lum

The brick off a bridge thing is not as rare as you'd think. It's just these days you only hear about it when it causes a serious accident, e.g. when they do it to a lorry.

But again, contingencies. I managed to stop the car safely, but it's possible that I may not have been able to do so. The correctly matched and nicely grippy tyres played a part here, but if those had failed (perhaps the brick could have knocked me out, with my foot still on the accelerator?) then It'd be down to the seatbelts and the structure of the car to reduce the severity of the accident.

If I'd gone down the "I'm a perfect driver, so I don't need these things" route. That incident could have turned out much much worse, in the end I just needed a new windscreen and had to wait 13 hours in A&E to get the glass removed from my eye.

alastairq

On the other hand, having gone out on a limb and supported a fair bit of what alastairq has been saying I'm not too happy with his dismissal of "no-one but him" getting the point because that suggests that he really does consider himself way out there in front and the only one who understands how to drive safely. Way to alienate any support you might have!

Sorry if you misunderstood what I'm trying to say.....the general direction of my comments was aimed at others who display typical 'lay' responses, not individuals in particular...such as yourself.

Whilst I suppose support is nice, I'm not particularly 'seeking' support......I'm making observations based upon the knowledge and experience I have, and have access to.


Maybe I don't put the point across very well, typing is not the same as verbal coaching and instruction.

There are going to occur situations which present total surprise to any driver....but the abilities of tyres or brakes aren't really going to help in those very rare situations. [yes, I have encountered the 'body from the sky' situation....when a person committed suicide of a local very high bridge, to land right in front of my bus......I did avoid compounding the mess, however. But that was decades ago.]

However, with proper application of skills of observation & anticipation, coupled with speed and position control, a driver can and will mitigate [ie reduce or negate] the effect of a problem arising, to the extent that dramatic evasive action may/will not be necessary.

Risk on the roads will never be eliminated totally.

But it is perfectly possible to act to reduce such risk down to almost an insignificant level [in normal traffic situations, at least]....and certainly to a level where dramatic action isn't necessary to cope....

All of which is well within the abilities of any driver, with a little bit of application.