BOE's prority must be preventing another housing boom.

Conrad

grizzly1911 wrote: »

You are the closer to the figures than most, whilst that may be the number that actual get the final court verdict I wonder how many capitulate and are forced to sell or hand over the keys prior to that point with or without a negative equity.

It would also be interesting to see those figures split by age of mortgage, and by LTV, to start with. Then of course the high street lenders are being soft at present with interest rates so low and political pressure according to the press..

1% repossession would suggest that the underwriters are doing very well and that the lenders are creaming it.

Well I meet lender reps all the time and they are privvy to repo and arrears numbers and I can say honestly that all of them have ordered mortgage books.

Funnily enough the worst performing category according to some lenders is shared ownership - funny isn't it, wherever Government is involved, things go awry. This is down to reasons such as housing assoications having to house criminals which can have a knock on effect with owners (rowdy neighbours / wrecking shared spaces etc) where some feel they have been let down by a system so they loose interest in making payments.

DervProf

Conrad wrote: »

Moi!

Terrible fraud in the mortgage world, I mean things are real bad, so bad that nearly 1% of owners get repossessed - awful, we're going down the pan in this country.

In the real world;

+ Peter Mandelson inflated his income to get a Chelsea BS mortgage

+ Anita Rodick, unable to get a business loan, instead used a car loan to start Bodyshop

+ Alan Sugar used a home improvment home loan to get Amstrad up and running

+ Ken Livingston bemoans civil servants for using Ltd co's to reduce thier Tax burde, but was doing it himself. Even a Saint like him gets up to things. Shock, call M16.

So, the message is loud and clear, if you want to be successful you need to "cheat".

And the conclusion is that because repo's are only 1%, there is very little mortgage fraud ? I'm sure that a dose of average base rates might expose some of the fraud that "hasn't happened". I suspect that the banks aren't exactly eager to repo much property at the moment anyway, it's not like they seem to be very willing to lend money to anyone who might want to take it off their hands.

Conrad

Graham_Devon wrote: »

See, you have started shouting about the injustice of it all again.

What happened to the walking to the well analogy? Why can't they just live 3 to a 1 bed flat conrad?

The point for me is that people have done the right thing and worked hard only to have the mortgage door slammed in thier face all down to regulation that didn't forsee these outcomes and administered by burecrats that haven't the feigntest idea they are forcing millions to rent.

Yea, I think that is a bit unjust and made doubly sour by the fact FSA regulation has a core principle known as 'treating customers fairly' but it does the exact opposite for millions. The ultimate unfairness is denying people that have saved and worked, a chance.


When it comes to your general principle that prices are too high, for me this is akin to idealism and thus irrelevant as price mechanisms are litteraly a natural law like weather, so why get bothered by it as nothing will ever change?

It's the very specific nature of 2007 FSA regulation with 'treating customers fairly' at it's core that I have a problem with as it does the exact opposite by forcing people to rent.
Why does this not bother you?
If you got divorced aged 59, and felt perfectly capable of sustaining a mortgage, knowing full well life may present you a new partner later / an inheritance / or you might just carry on working, what would you make of a nanny state shaking it's head and denying you a mortgage?

DervProf

Conrad wrote: »

If the client tells me the deposit is a gift from parents, who the heck am i to interogate them, but in reality some will be car loans.

I tell you who you are. You are the person helping them to borrow money from a lender. If the deposit is a car loan, and your client tells you that the money is a gift, doesn't that affect their ability to pay the mortgage that they are applying for ? If they have borrowed the money from another lender (under whatever pretence), then surely they will have to pay it back. If they come to you and you accept that the money is a gift (without question, but knowing that there is a chance that the money may have been borrowed from a bank), then surely it is in your interest to try to find out if they are telling the truth, rather than helping them fill in the application form.

Graham_Devon

Conrad wrote: »

Well I meet lender reps all the time and they are privvy to repo and arrears numbers and I can say honestly that all of them have ordered mortgage books.

Dunno how, as the banks have stated themselves, even they don't know how many mortgages they have under forebearance.

Jimmy_31

Conrad wrote: »

The point for me is that people have done the right thing and worked hard only to have the mortgage door slammed in thier face all down to regulation that didn't forsee these outcomes and administered by burecrats that haven't the feigntest idea they are forcing millions to rent.

Yea, I think that is a bit unjust and made doubly sour by the fact FSA regulation has a core principle known as 'treating customers fairly' but it does the exact opposite for millions. The ultimate unfairness is denying people that have saved and worked, a chance.


When it comes to your general principle that prices are too high, for me this is akin to idealism and thus irrelevant as price mechanisms are litteraly a natural law like weather, so why get bothered by it as nothing will ever change?

It's the very specific nature of 2007 FSA regulation with 'treating customers fairly' at it's core that I have a problem with as it does the exact opposite by forcing people to rent.
Why does this not bother you?
If you got divorced aged 59, and felt perfectly capable of sustaining a mortgage, knowing full well life may present you a new partner later / an inheritance / or you might just carry on working, what would you make of a nanny state shaking it's head and denying you a mortgage?

If i was 59 and taking out a mortgage i would definitely see that as a chance.

shortchanged_2

And some wonder why many people see mortgage brokers as bent as a butchers hook.

Graham_Devon

Conrad wrote: »

The point for me is that people have done the right thing and worked hard only to have the mortgage door slammed in thier face all down to regulation that didn't forsee these outcomes and administered by burecrats that haven't the feigntest idea they are forcing millions to rent.

Right, so why do you feel others who are younger, who have also worked hard, should have to accept the situation, stop moaning, think of the people walking to the well, and live 2-3 to a 1 bed flat?

Did they have the opportunity to forsee outcomes? Or is it only your clients already in the game who have come a croper to their OWN decisions who should receive empathy?

You can explain all you like, but I'm completely at a loss to try and figure out how you can suggest some just get on with it and think about what they have compared to others....yet when it comes to your own issues, it's unfair and unjust that things change?

Think my rank hypocrisy point has been made now anyway. So will stop banging the drum.

Conrad

DervProf wrote: »

So, the message is loud and clear, if you want to be successful you need to "cheat".

I'm not sure cheat is the right adjective.
Don't people present thier best side in a CV?

Don't scientists eagre to win a new tranche of research grant, oversell and massage things some?

Doesn't Billy Bragg feign his down with the people credentials yet in fact live in a £1.5m house and have no doubt considerable wealth? Isn't even he a bit of a mirage?

Don't Solicitors make a divorce as arduous as possible and thus cause proceedings to extend and fees to increase?

Doesn't George Mobiot (Green peace) preach about carbon footprints and then go off and have 6 children!?

Doesn't Poly Toignbe profess to be green and a sharer of wealth yet cling to £5m in property wealth alone and FLY to her Tuscan villa 4 times a year? Imagine the energy it takes to run her villa and fly there.


Dont much admired BBC people like David Dimblbe present a holyier than thou persona, raising eyebrows at MP's expenses, yet all the while funneling millions of licence fee money into thier service companies?

Did not Peter Mandelson (and many more MP's) fiddle thier mortgage app?

Does not Tracey Emen claim money is nothing to her, yet she clings to millions - talk about a fraud!? And I bet people fall for it.

DervProf

Conrad wrote: »

I'm not sure cheat is the right adjective.
Don't people present thier best side in a CV?

Don't scientists eagre to win a new tranche of research grant, oversell and massage things some?

Doesn't Billy Bragg feign his down with the people credentials yet in fact live in a £1.5m house and have no doubt considerable wealth? Isn't even he a bit of a mirage?

Don't Solicitors make a divorce as arduous as possible and thus cause proceedings to extend and fees to increase?

Doesn't George Mobiot (Green peace) preach about carbon footprints and then go off and have 6 children!?

Doesn't Poly Toignbe profess to be green and a sharer of wealth yet cling to £5m in property wealth alone and FLY to her Tuscan villa 4 times a year? Imagine the energy it takes to run her villa and fly there.


Dont much admired BBC people like David Dimblbe present a holyier than thou persona, raising eyebrows at MP's expenses, yet all the while funneling millions of licence fee money into thier service companies?

Did not Peter Mandelson (and many more MP's) fiddle thier mortgage app?

Does not Tracey Emen claim money is nothing to her, yet she clings to millions - talk about a fraud!? And I bet people fall for it.

OK, how about "fiddling, dishonest crooks*" ?

You seem to be condoning their actions, in which case you are probably a "very good" mortgage broker.

*crooks is probably a bit harsh, as I don't know if any crime is being committed in these cases.