'Consultation over the Gambling Introductory Offer Loopholes board' blog discussion

JimmyTheWig

northernpunter wrote: »

To reiterate YET AGAIN every single bet is laid off or dutched, and WE DO NOT GAMBLE

I think it would be helpful, to help put this idea of gambling to bed, if someone on the MSE team could come on here and confirm categorically that we are not talking about gambling, and that any discussion of gambling is not currently allowed and that this isn't due to change.

JimmyTheWig

purt wrote: »

I think the GIOL section of MSE has often been viewed with disdain by more seasoned matched bettors elsewhere because MSE has opened up matched betting to a wider audience and with it the demand is perceived to have led to a reduction in loopholes to exploit.

I think if nothing else, this is a reason to keep the board open.

Yes, it is a shame if seasoned matched bettors have less offers.
But just stop and remember for a minute why these bookies do these offers? Is it for seasoned matched bettors? Is it for new matched bettors? Or is it to entice new customers in to the world of gambling? Without a doubt it is the latter.

Therefore, what we are saying is that this board is reducing the quality of offers a bookmaker is willing to give which will reduce the number of new gambling punters. If MSE has any sort of remit at all, I am sure that helping to keep desperate people away from the idea that gambling is a solution is within that remit.

jamesallen

I must have made £1500+ on Matched Betting, and I've never tried anything advanced or faintly risky. The WH risk-frees and the occasional email offer still keep me ticking over with a few extra tenners a month even though I don't put in much effort now I've used up all the major sign-ups. If that doesn't have a place on a money saving forum, I don't know what does.

Idiots will always be idiots, but the GIOL forum, with its vast array of garish, bold warning signs and numerous experienced posters, is the best environment for matched betting to occur. If people choose to ignore the numerous warnings given against risky behaviour, or go against advice, then it's their own fault. No reasonable person could blame the site or the many excellent individuals who contribute to the GIOL board.

There have always been more complicated offers available (well, for a few years at least) - it's quite clear that they are more complicated, and again much advice is given on treading carefully. If outright risk-taking is being promoted, enforce the rules better.

Don't ruin a perfectly good forum which can make people thousands of pounds in risk free cash because you're worried the occasional idiot just might stray across it, ignore every warning and sticky in place, and go and mess up miserably. Personal responsibility has to come into this somewhere, and it's well before that point.

jamesallen

globalds wrote: »

Maybe time to close it.

regrettably as I have just (Christmas) introduced my son to the art of clicking real money into existence.

But MSE is such a large operation it does affect the industry. GIOL has made it harder to match bet.

MSE has ever been about taking the power away from economic powerhouses and those profiting from information asymmetry, and giving it to the money saving masses. Why should we close a board because it's made it harder for a few people to make many many thousands, in exchange for opening up the field for far more people to make a couple of thousand? There are some great opportunities out there to make cash if you're new to MBing, and Cheltenham, WH etc. keeps the rest of us ticking over, whilst others move to arbing and so on.

We should not be depriving the many of a chance to make substantial amounts of money, because we are afraid of preventing the few from making even more.

altec_09

I will be forever indebted to MSE giol but I can understand why it doesn't currently fit with Martin's ethos. Although to be honest the rest of his site/weekly emails I could write myself as I generally already know about the best loan rates/credit cards etc.

This section of the website has some of the most intelligent people of any of the MSE forums and I feel by closing GIOL they would all migrate to R-Points http://www.rpoints.com/forum/f21/

For those of us who have been in the game over a year it doesn't really matter if MSE stays open or not. By closing GIOL it could well stop an influx of newbies to the profitable game of matched betting.

MT90

Close it without doubt, you don't hold an AA meeting inside a pub.

Many MSErs are in desperate circumstances which are exactly the punters bookies want.

BGB

MT90 wrote: »

Close it without doubt, you don't hold an AA meeting inside a pub.

Many MSErs are in desperate circumstances which are exactly the punters bookies want.

There are 2 types of people on MSE those with no money and those that are careful with their money. Neither are of interest to bookmakers. Most on GIOL fall in the latter catergory and are loathed by bookmakers.

MT90

BGB wrote: »

There are 2 types of people on MSE those with no money and those that are careful with their money. Neither are of interest to bookmakers. Most on GIOL fall in the latter catergory and are loathed by bookmakers.

Don't be so naive, you see it all the time when a poster writes 'I made a mistake' and when asked about it they have used money they can not afford to use.

Its all well and good having rules but if no one sticks to them because they are desperate than Martin ought to remove the temptation.

From Martin's perspective, he should care about ensuring that he is not promoting the risk of anyone getting in serious debt rather than run that risk just to allow 'those that are careful with their money' to make a bit extra. Plenty of other sites outhere or that would open up if closed here.

Jimmythewig, are you serious? MBing is secretly destroying the Gambling industry for the good of society by publicly and loudly broadcasting a 'win-win system'?

danthemoneysavingman

I used to do it but found it took up a lot of time. Sadly I lost all I made due to one in-match bet, which was allowed at time of placement in what seemed a good arb, but they came back after the event and said "this bet is void as you shouldn't've been able to place it in-running". Had this not happened I'd've continued I guess. The problem was they can void bets which could work in your favour but on this occassion did not. The rules are clear though indeed very complex, and people that can't understand it shouldn't even try it. A big health warning at top of the board should be sufficient in my opinion, my 2p worth anyway

BGB

MT90 wrote: »

Don't be so naive, you see it all the time when a poster writes 'I made a mistake' and when asked about it they have used money they can not afford to use.

Its all well and good having rules but if no one sticks to them because they are desperate than Martin ought to remove the temptation.

From Martin's perspective, he should care about ensuring that he is not promoting the risk of anyone getting in serious debt rather than run that risk just to allow 'those that are careful with their money' to make a bit extra. Plenty of other sites outhere or that would open up if closed here.

Jimmythewig, are you serious? MBing is secretly destroying the Gambling industry for the good of society by publicly and loudly broadcasting a 'win-win system'?

I wasn't being naive I was just refuting your ludicrous suggestion that bookies are glad that GIOL exists. Niaive would accurately describe that particular assertion

I'd wager a large amount (see what i did there) that most of those people sayiong I made a big mistake and the bailiff is at the door posters are simply people who want the forum shut and no doubt no more about matched betting than you or I.

In terms of the forum having 'strayed far from it's original purpose' it is not the forum it is the bookmakers who have tried all manner of things to prevent people make regular easy money all the forum members have done is come up with increasingly ingenius methods of extracting profits from them and then carefully and painstakingly explained these to others.

What makes GIOL so amazing is that the experienced posters there show endless patience showing people how to do something that is manifestly not in their interest. The more people that exploit these loopholes the fewer loopholes there will be. These people should be lauded for what is genuinely selfless acts of kindness.