'Consultation over the Gambling Introductory Offer Loopholes board' blog discussion

*Chattie*

sound like a path to the bottom, what next Wonga/Payday loans to sponsor the Loans board?

Anonmouse

Hey_Dude wrote: »

I have a sinking feeling about where this is going to end up.

I've always been with MSE since I started MBing 2 and a bit years ago....with 'hoping for the best and planning for the worst' in mind if the worst does happen and I wish to continue to associate with a community that mirrors MSE in terms of tips and heads up to offers where do I go?

Any recommendations would be welcome.

Rpoints seems to have become the default option, many people already headed over there: http://www.rpoints.com/forum/f21/

TGT seems to have closed to new members, presumably in reaction to this - guessing they don't want to get flooded. The info on the boards isn't worth much imo but the cashback can pay for the subscription easy enough.

JimmyTheWig

*Chattie* wrote: »

sound like a path to the bottom, what next Wonga/Payday loans to sponsor the Loans board?

I'm not suggesting sponsorship. And I'm not suggesting that MBers do anything different than they already do.
But if there's a way to keep doing what is currently happening and make money for the site then that's got to be a good thing, hasn't it? That's how the whole site is funded.

*Chattie*

you are suggesting that affiliate links from bookies fund a member of MSE staff though

woodcroft

Even better, you want to get some of them free staff the government are dishing out.

3 months work exp learning GIOL and other MSE techniques, then they're off earning twice x mw for themselves, and on to the next one.

Everyone wins

super_reds

Tim_L wrote: »

Nice of you to say that, but frankly you would be in the same position. The issue with the board at the time of FGS and since was simply that people thought they were operating in a safe bubble and they could get away with anything, and to be brutally honest there wasn't a lot of knowledge on the board.

And if PRS is any guide, that situation hasn't changed much.

Remember, at the time I was BG I was running at basically professional levels - not at the top of the tree but a branch a decent way up. I certainly did know my stuff and I was sitting on tens of thousands of pounds of profit a year, so I could afford to sail fairly close to the wind. For people doing basic matched betting, the best advice was always given - don't follow the mob into a dodgy book, keep away from horse racing and tennis, don't put yourself at risk with multiple accounts, don't take unnecessary risks.

The problem was (and PRS would suggest is) that many of the people doing medium advanced matched betting became over confident and borderline c0cky and would lead people onto dangerous ground because they felt they had a God given right to discuss it in what was essentially the nursery playground. Discuss more complicated things by all means between yourself - I was, on IRC channels - but for f's sake not in front of people for whom losing 50 quid is a disaster.

I haven't been near a bookmaker site for a couple of years and I feel I'm well out of it. I look back at the people I was working with, and to be honest I see glassy eyed obsession and near psychosis in some cases. I've seen nice people turn into monsters, and I don't exclude myself from that analysis. I'm sorry if I was rude, I don't doubt that was true, but that is the nature of the beast as you do this more and more intensively. It's a very competitive and very hard edged world, and you haven't the time or inclination to be patient with others.

The issue with keeping the board open or not is complex, but on balance I'd close it. There are other places to go for the information and to chat, and the proximity issue where you're somewhere close to boards where often not particularly shrewd people are going for advice on financial problems is to my mind the overriding one. I always rather enjoyed the fact that young mothers were making some spare cash at the bookies' expense for their children or families, and that's why I always argued in favour of the board at a time when frankly it was causing me more grief than it brought direct benefit. But the thought that bad or malicious advice might cause someone in that situation to lose a lot of money was and is terrifying.

Good, well constructed, thoughtful post Tim, thanks for your input. Just one disagreement re PRS, that thread would never have been allowed to run for over a year under your guidance, the damage caused would thus have been much much less than it has been to date and so not sure that the Board would have deteriorated to the level it clearly has.

Tim_L

super_reds wrote: »

Good, well constructed, thoughtful post Tim, thanks for your input. Just one disagreement re PRS, that thread would never have been allowed to run for over a year under your guidance, the damage caused would thus have been much much less than it has been to date and so not sure that the Board would have deteriorated to the level it clearly has.

Probably what would have happened is that I'd have tried to persuade people not to go in, there would be arguments from a few board regulars on the basis that I had done this that and the other in the past, then the awkward troll squad would have turned up with comments about FGS or things they'd found at 192.com, I'd have lost patience and locked the thread or deleted it, someone else would start up sniping about inconsistent moderation in another thread, there'd be a some more afters about discussing casino bonuses and I'd ask myself why I was bothering and beggar off.

Which in essence was what happened.

While this was going on, I was also seeing people nicking the tools and methods I'd developed for general benefit and people running referral sites with them, and also people who had used them attempting to close off the knowledge to newcomers, in fact that was the motivation of many of the trolls and probably still is. Doesn't exactly give you a high opinion of general humanity.

It's this potent cocktail of greed and the need to have other eyes looking around for you. Frankly if this forum closes it's a 2 minute job to create a new one somewhere else, but what people fear is it not achieving critical mass so they can see offers, or some clique forming that excludes them. That can develop into what appears to be genuine psychosis in some cases.

I remember we invited one girl onto the IRC channel where we hung out to discuss arbing, she figured it out over a few months and made some cash and then suddenly one Christmas developed paranoid delusions that other people on the channel were sharing arbs behind her back on secret channels, and proceeded to kick and ban everyone else as if she'd invented the whole thing in the first place.

Which of course isn't a wonderful solution on IRC because you just set up a new channel, we were p1ssing ourselves - the chat log was hysterically funny. She was always a bit peculiar though, and still is, from what I can gather she's in her own channel which has RULES and committees and runs a tight and rather humourless ship. The point is that this does strange things to you if done to excess. It's endless cliques and subcliques and it doesn't really matter. Just set up somewhere else with people you like. Discuss what you want. But worry about the people for whom losses are a big deal and make sensible judgements about what if any advice to give them.

bifbet

Oh the irony,

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/51302623#Comment_51302623

The very introduction by the mse staff is and i quote

"This is the discussion thread for the following MSE News Story:

"Parents can choose cash or gamble on the markets with an equity Isa. John Chapman, TQ Invest MD, explains the options

So its OK to discuss gambling your kids savings and inheritance but taking that money and using it to much better effect matched betting is a no no.

Close that section now, i feel a sudden urge to throw all my money on the markets,

Apologies for a completely unconstructive post but i could not help myself.

meher

*Chattie* wrote: »

you are suggesting

I did (and you know it). I believe everyone making a good business through mse should pay royalties to mse; whether Martin or his team wishes to accept it is an entirely different discussion, if appropriate.

*Chattie* wrote: »

sound like a path to the bottom, what next Wonga/Payday loans to sponsor the Loans board?

loans board is not a slippery road terittory because it is a subject this site has actively campainged against

*Chattie* wrote: »

that affiliate links fund

... so the cardinal sin commited in suggesting is ... ?

thelawnet

bifbet wrote: »

Oh the irony,

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/51302623#Comment_51302623

The very introduction by the mse staff is and i quote

"This is the discussion thread for the following MSE News Story:

"Parents can choose cash or gamble on the markets with an equity Isa. John Chapman, TQ Invest MD, explains the options

So its OK to discuss gambling your kids savings and inheritance but taking that money and using it to much better effect matched betting is a no no.

You obviously don't understand what a figure of speech is.

Investment carries risk, but it is not gambling.