bathroom bill

zaffi

a good mate of ours has been fitting our new bathroom. he has just finished and gave us our invoice, it's higher than we were expecting, but he's a mate and i've got no idea what the "real" price should have been. any thoughts to put mind at ease would be much appreciated.

I know it's probably naive not to discuss total cost upfront, but we never thought it'd be an issue!

what we've already paid

Suite - bath, toilet, vanity cabinet, shower screen, radiator, mirror all wastes and taps. admittedly got at trade prices through said mate. approx £1100

plumber - who removed the previous suite and installed new suite and new radiator also re-installed shower. He charged £530

electrician - who installed a vent, the mirror and the lighting, he provided vent and lights. He charged £260

what mate charged

this is his invoice verbatim

main bathroom Price £1868.00
re plasterboard all walls and tile
fit ply to floor and tile
strap ceiling and fit PVC ceiling

Materials £956.86
all materials supplied

included in materials were all tiles (20m2 wall and 4m2 floor) the ceiling and the bath panel

does his invoice of £2824.86 seem right and im i just showing the absolute zero i know when it comes to home improvement?

Oldsoak

A full bathroom gutted, boarded, tiled, plumbed and wiring. Seems like a reasonable cost to me, average bathroom will cost between 3-5k depending on suite and tiles. I fitted a wall hung sink and draw cabinet for a customer the other week that cost half that much alone.
No a bad price I would say, but hardly mates' rates.

zaffi

Oldsoak wrote: »

A full bathroom gutted, boarded, tiled, plumbed and wiring. Seems like a reasonable cost to me, average bathroom will cost between 3-5k depending on suite and tiles. I fitted a wall hung sink and draw cabinet for a customer the other week that cost half that much alone.
No a bad price I would say, but hardly mates' rates.

cheers for the reply, that's what i thought. I guess we're a bit annoyed as we thought (wrongly) that there was an acceptance on both parts that we were looking to do it on a budget, we specifically asked him to price up a full bathroom suite for as cheap as possible, as he knows we're looking to sell in the next year or so so to then be hit with £1900 for his time and labour was a bit shocking

Also because we assumed mates rates, we afforded him a hell of alot of time to complete. myself and the plumber ripped everything out at the start of december and the room wasn't fully usable until 3 days before xmas we were without a shower for best part of 2 weeks. it wasn't technically "finished" until yesterday.

just feel like he's taken the p1ss, we could've had a homebase or b and q number for a hell of a lot less money, time and hassle.

keystone

Theres no such thing as "mates rates" unless the contractor involved is not declaring the income and therefore not paying tax. He's still got bills to pay, he's still got to eat. An average bathroom costs between £ 1500 and £ 2k labour and around £ 500 general building materials but excluing suite and tiles and taps etc. An average bathroom takes two weeks including any plastering and electrical work. Spefics will be different in both labour and materials.

Sorry but you are away with the fairies if you think you'd have got your install done cheaper and quicker via one of the sheds.

No on the face of it he hasn't taken the pi$$ but if you've also paid a plumber and sparks the best part of £900 already then I would be looking at the breakdown. Plumbers bill should be within the window I've indicated. Sparks perhaps not but it looks about right.

But the truth is that you are BOTH at fault here. Just because he might be a friend thats no reason for the paperwork for a job, quote, specification, contract, invoice, completion paperwork etc not to be done properly. He should have insisted on it and so should you.

Cheers

zaffi

keystone wrote: »

Theres no such thing as "mates rates" unless the contractor involved is not declaring the income and therefore not paying tax. He's still got bills to pay, he's still got to eat. An average bathroom costs between £ 1500 and £ 2k labour and around £ 500 general building materials but excluing suite and tiles and taps etc. An average bathroom takes two weeks including any plastering and electrical work. Spefics will be different in both labour and materials.

Sorry but you are away with the fairies if you think you'd have got your install done cheaper and quicker via one of the sheds.

No on the face of it he hasn't taken the pi$$ but if you've also paid a plumber and sparks the best part of £900 already then I would be looking at the breakdown. Plumbers bill should be within the window I've indicated. Sparks perhaps not but it looks about right.

But the truth is that you are BOTH at fault here. Just because he might be a friend thats no reason for the paperwork for a job, quote, specification, contract, invoice, completion paperwork etc not to be done properly. He should have insisted on it and so should you.

Cheers

we've paid almost 3K in labour for a very small room**

surely for less than 5K we could have got one from one of the big retailers? it might not have been great, but it was understood by everyone that's not what we were looking for, we were looking for a budget bathroom, to use for a year or so which would possibly help sell the house down the line. as for the two week thing, that's fair but we've been sitting on a toilet since christmas that wasn't square and hadn't been secured until yesterday

The last 2 hightlighted bits, your right and it has certainly been lesson learned we assumed he understood that we were using him to cut costs, we should have asked his labour costs upfront. But also, given he knew we were on a budget, I'd have hoped he would have volunteered the information that his labour alone would be 40% of the total.

But I accept i've been naive, I didn't get all the details upfront for the simple fact that he's a mate.

edit: ** room is 2.4m by 1.6m - had to get non standard 1500mm bath

Barneysmom

This?

main bathroom Price £1868.00
re plasterboard all walls and tile
fit ply to floor and tile
strap ceiling and fit PVC ceiling


Is that £1868 just for labour? If so it is a mad bill, especially if he is not paying tax.

In reality it should only be about a week's work there

Day 1. Ceiling.
Day2. Plasterboard.
Day3. Tiles
Day 4 Floor/tiles
day 5 Grout and finish.

Ask why the labour charge is so high, get a proper breakdown

zaffi

Barneysmom wrote: »

This?

main bathroom Price £1868.00
re plasterboard all walls and tile
fit ply to floor and tile
strap ceiling and fit PVC ceiling


Is that £1868 just for labour? If so it is a mad bill, especially if he is not paying tax.

In reality it should only be about a week's work there

Day 1. Ceiling.
Day2. Plasterboard.
Day3. Tiles
Day 4 Floor/tiles
day 5 Grout and finish.

Ask why the labour charge is so high, get a proper breakdown

yeah it is, i think he is paying tax though

Idiophreak

Sounds like quite a lot to me, considering it doesn't include the plumber or sparkie...so 2k just for a bit of plastering and tiling, with materials on top? Ouch. I'd imagine you'd get it done for half that amount if you advertised on FindMeARandomBuilder.com or whatever and that's not even "mates rates". Out of interest, how long was he actually on site for in total?

zaffi

Idiophreak wrote: »

Sounds like quite a lot to me, considering it doesn't include the plumber or sparkie...so 2k just for a bit of plastering and tiling, with materials on top? Ouch. I'd imagine you'd get it done for half that amount if you advertised on FindMeARandomBuilder.com or whatever and that's not even "mates rates". Out of interest, how long was he actually on site for in total?

I don't know, we gave him a key 2 months ago and got it back yesterday!

there were times he'd be in for a full day, but others only a couple of hours. Majority of the time he was in, we weren't.

again, it comes back to him being a mate, we didn't feel like we had to be clock watching with him.

I don't know how to ask for a more detailed breakdown of his costs without putting our friendship on the line if he were to think that we thought he had overcharged, if you see what i mean.

keystone

You'd be surprised how little difference the size of the room makes. A bath still has to be plumbed in and fitted as does the basin, as does the loo (if its not separate). You still have 4 corners, a window, a door and sanitaryware to tile around. So same number of cuts whether its a large room or small. Large areas of wall tiling are simple once you've found the centres and it takes no time at all.

In fact the smaller the room then the more challenging it becomes. Anything equal to or less than a "standard" 1930s semi sized bathroom and there is only room for one person at any one time. There is no point in trying to get two peeps in there at any one time. I once did one bathroom that was only 1.6m x 1.6 total and the loo was in there too. I had to take the loo out every morning before starting work and put it back again in the evening so that the client was able to perform natural functions. Slashed 30 minutes off the days worktime every single day!

However, I would say that his somewhat lackadaisical approach to timekeeping is a tad concerning. It implies he was doing two jobs in parallel which is a bit naughty. Having said that I have no proof that is the case and if you didn't agree a completion date with him and him with you then you are partially culpable. I see no reason why you shouldn't ask him for a breakdown. This was a business relationship and friendship doesn't come into it. And you are right - whether you know him or not you've trusted him with a job and watching his every move and/or clockwatching is not conducive.

Cheers

keystone

Idiophreak wrote: »

I'd imagine you'd get it done for half that amount if you advertised on FindMeARandomBuilder.com or whatever and that's not even "mates rates".

Imagination doesn't come into it IMHO. The reality is that is that the average bathroom costs are as I;'ve previously stated. And sites like that or whatever.........Grrrr - waste of time, money and energy.

Cheers