Greece...

antrobus

remorseless wrote: »

...and they wonder why the coffers were getting empty!!!! $32K/capita?? Was it the Hellenic Republic or El Dorado?.....

Those would have to be PPP numbers.

At market prices Greek per capita GDP would be more like €16k or $18k US.

remorseless wrote: »

..What do they make/do to justify the high GDP/per capita? Even $22K is till high...

Shipping? Tourism?

wotsthat

princeofpounds wrote: »

Good move from Varoufakis. Take the victory and run before the consequences.

Do you think he was given a choice? Sounds like he was sacked to me.

mwpt

ruggedtoast wrote: »

This will be wiping the stony frown from Merkel's face, and replacing it with a stonier frown.

Looks like the Greek's aren't interested in another 1930`s style fiscal shafting at the hands of the neo deutschmark.

I don't blame them for not being interested. But what they're interested in is really of little consequence unless they're prepared to use the only real weapon they have in this game and default.

Otherwise they're just beggars threatening to spit on passers by if they don't drop a coin.

princeofpounds

Do you think he was given a choice? Sounds like he was sacked to me.

oh I have no doubt he jumped before he was pushed. But I really do think he is picking this path too.

ruggedtoast

mwpt wrote: »

I don't blame them for not being interested. But what they're interested in is really of little consequence unless they're prepared to use the only real weapon they have in this game and default.

Otherwise they're just beggars threatening to spit on passers by if they don't drop a coin.

No one knows whats going to happen. This is uncharted territory.

While the German tabloids will follow your view pretty closely, it isn't lost on much of the rest of Europe that German banks have been making a killing lending to Greece so the Greeks can keep German factories humming 24/7 selling them goods. The weakened euro-mark hasn't done Germany's other exports any harm either.

The Greeks have done their best to repay the loans that they should never have been given. Now they have defaulted which comes as a surprise to anyone. The bankers dont care, their losses will be absorbed by tax payers as usual, the only question is which tax payers?

remorseless

ruggedtoast wrote: »

The Greeks have done their best to repay the loans that they should never have been given.

What was the other option then? Let them default? Outcome has only been delayed but eventually it was inevitable!

ruggedtoast

remorseless wrote: »

What was the other option then? Let them default? Outcome has only been delayed but eventually it was inevitable!

They shouldn't have been able to accumulate the debt in the first place as they never met any of the terms for Euro entry. The Greek government was so inefficient and corrupt the auditors had to stop auditing them otherwise the 'wrong' result would have been arrived at. And France and Germany didn't want the wrong result.

Greece in the early 90's was legitimately a third world country. People actually using donkeys for transport and children tied to beds in orphanages because the state had no mechanism or money to look after them.

Letting them into the euro was no different to giving a single mother on benefits a platinum card with a year's 0% APR.

What Greece needed was aid and development and phased entry into the modern world. Thats exactly what they didn't get and I have no sympathy whatsoever that the Germans are now pretending their had no idea their loans wouldnt be fully repaid.

At least, I notice, France has the good grace to be embarrassed enough about their role in this catastrophe to mostly be quiet on the subject.

Merkel might want to borrow a bit of humility as I suspect the Euro Community's goodwill to her country might start to dry up pretty quickly if they think the German money taps have been turned off.

cells

ruggedtoast wrote: »

No one knows whats going to happen. This is uncharted territory.

While the German tabloids will follow your view pretty closely, it isn't lost on much of the rest of Europe that German banks have been making a killing lending to Greece so the Greeks can keep German factories humming 24/7 selling them goods. The weakened euro-mark hasn't done Germany's other exports any harm either.

The Greeks have done their best to repay the loans that they should never have been given. Now they have defaulted which comes as a surprise to anyone. The bankers dont care, their losses will be absorbed by tax payers as usual, the only question is which tax payers?

I doubt very much greeks borrowed 300 billoom euros to buys mercs and power plants from Germany

They borrowed 300 billion euros to allow people to retire age 50 and receive a state pension of 1500 euro a month

I doubt the Germans are as evil as some think they are a logical people ans probably jist want the geeks to put their house in order qith things lole more realistic retirement social funds and to run a government which respects and enforces its own tax law

Graham_Devon

ruggedtoast wrote: »

At least, I notice, France has the good grace to be embarrassed enough about their role in this catastrophe to mostly be quiet on the subject.

Got a lot to do with Hollande in my humble opinion. I doubt the French voice would have been quite so quiet under Sarkozy.

Yolina

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Got a lot to do with Hollande in my humble opinion. I doubt the French voice would have been quite so quiet under Sarkozy.

Hollande is in so much trouble at home, he's probably trying not to rock the boat too much...