Is it ok to be rude to...

Elvisia

I am currently signing on and I have to apply for jobs I am over qualified for, and I just feel terrible sending off applications for jobs I know I won't be able to get. I feel it's such a waste of time for the person the other end to read it, particularly when it's obviously going to a manager rather than just a pile in HR. I apply for lots of jobs which are in the area I have experience of working in and I am qualified, which has lead to many interviews and 'near misses'.

The JC is very good at missing sections off in job descriptions, must be something to do when they print them out, as often I have to spend more time trying to find the jobs online (what they have on their machines in the JC is different to their main website) in order to send an application in the first place!

LadyMissA

Voyager2002 wrote: »

If only...

A more immediate point: today's applicant may well be tomorrow's customer. A company that manages to give even a single useful sentence as constructive feedback to every unsuccessful applicant will probably do more to create a positive brand image than could be achieved by any PR agency.

I read that (today's applicant may well be tomorrow's customer) the other day and I agree. Especially if you advertise on the Job Centres website I think it only polite to reply even if its a bog standard thanks but no thanks to everyone who wasn't succesful.

dickydonkin

jobbingmusician wrote: »

My prediction - over 50% don't meet PS
Another 30% don't follow the instructions for applicants (you could tighten up on these, if you needed to save response time. I saved a lot of energy once by specifying EXACTLY how an administration manager should apply for a job - 80% of the applications were binned immediately!)

And I dare gamble that many of those 80% that were 'binned immediately' who had made the effort to apply would have been suitable applicants.

Recruitment is not an EXACT science - unless you want robots of course!

If an employer or recruiter is specifying that every applicant must meet EVERY element of the job and person spec - then that employer will undoubtedly allow some able and excellent applicants to slip through their net. Yes - requirements must be established - but to stick to those rigidly with no flexibility is (in my opinion) not the best route.

In these days where employers can be particular and incorporate other roles into a specific job, I suspect many job applicants will not meet the job or indeed the person spec.

That said - it would be interesting to know how many posters on here who have applied for jobs and have not met all of the requirements have actually been successful - I suspect there will be many - and I bet many are an asset to their employer.

The moral 'highgrounders' would also very likely condemn a jobseeker receiving benefits who would not apply for a job when they did not satisfy all of the required specifications.

Factor in desperation, jobseekers agreements and the lack of jobs - and it is hardly surprising that many people apply for positions where they don't fully satisfy the requirements.

It seems you are damned if you do apply and damned if you don't.

Hermia

We don't advertise our professional posts in the job centre etc and we still get some really pointless applications. The jobs require a very specific postgraduate degree and chartered membership of the professional association and we get lots of applications from people who just have GCSEs and have absolutely no experience in the field. I don't have a problem if someone doesn't have some minor requirement, but applies because they are sure they could do the job. But this is just lunacy though as they simply wouldn't be able to do any of the job.

dickydonkin

Hermia wrote: »

We don't advertise our professional posts and we still get some really pointless applications. The jobs require a very specific postgraduate degree and chartered membership of the professional association and we get lots of applications from people who just have GCSEs and have absolutely no experience in the field. I don't have a problem if someone doesn't have some minor requirement, but applies because they are sure they could do the job. But this is just lunacy though as they simply wouldn't be able to do any of the job.

That's a fair point in respect of senior posts and specific essential criteria such as you described that is relevant to a professional position.

What is disappointing to applicants is when recruiters adhere strictly to every element of the requirements in jobs that are at the middle to lower end of the scale.

Unfortunately for applicants, employers are now in a position to be very selective - but having the required academic qualifications does not necessarily mean that person will be better at the job that the applicant that hasn't.

I have seen many supposed 'academicaly gifted' people who have no grasp of the real world and many who just don't have a modicum of common sense.

Elvisia

Dickydonkin- I completely agree. I wasn't qualified for my last job but I spent all my free time catching up so I could do the best I could, and I got more positive results than my colleagues who were qualified. I only got the position as they were desperate and my CV happened to land on the right desk at the right time. I have been frustrated at getting very close to getting jobs but just missing out because of one aspect that I felt could be learnt on the job, and I have now got to the point where I wonder if good candidates are overlooked because of this. I had to work with a new team member on a website who it became apparent had been employed because of their knowledge of the subject, but not of their knowledge of websites, and it took an age to train them up and they really were upset that there wasn't someone ready to code their text for them. Also if you're not good at job interviews you'll find it very hard.

However if I were an HR person and I was getting endless applications that were just generic ones being sent off to please the Job Centre, I think I would start to feel peeved. I was asked to apply by the Job Centre to be a professor of chemistry when I am a professor of English and I know nothing about the subject. I would imagine the HR person when they got my application wondered what on earth I was doing, and I felt embarrassed sending it off. But the Job Centre making people apply for jobs they can't do is a whole other thread!!

FunnySaving

bluelight wrote: »

When people have gone to the time and trouble to prepare a CV and send it in, is it any wonder they are reluctant to apply to other employers if they don't receive any communication at all?

But surely applicants should be motivated to apply to other employers for the benefits to themselves of finding a job - it's not an employer's job to make them feel good about themselves in order to fuel the enthusiasm for their job hunt. I have read several interviews with people who complain that they don't feel motivated to apply for jobs when one employer after another fails to respond, but it's cutting off your nose to spite your face to remain unemployed to teach a 'rude' employer a lesson!

Savvy_Sue

Elvisia wrote: »

I was asked to apply by the Job Centre to be a professor of chemistry when I am a professor of English and I know nothing about the subject. I would imagine the HR person when they got my application wondered what on earth I was doing, and I felt embarrassed sending it off.

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl: I'm laughing because otherwise I think I'd cry ... and I would have put a note in to the effect that I'd been advised to apply by the Job Centre, and let the employer complain if they felt it appropriate.

I don't advertise with the JC because it really wasn't helpful to us, jobs were left up long after the closing date, unsuitable applicants etc. Pointing this out to them got us nowhere.

Elvisia

I did write at the top of my letter that I had been asked to apply by the Job Centre, as I felt quite humiliated. I was given four jobs by the JC when I signed on one week to apply for, none of which was I suitable for, but they had all come up because the job titles (which were very general) matched what I had signed in my agreement. This job was titled 'professor' so she said it matched what I had agreed I could do. I needed to have a PhD in chemistry, and mine is in English. This isn't the first time I've been made to apply for jobs I have no qualifications for, which is why when I have my review meeting on Friday I have planned to tell them I would like to sign off. I spend all day researching jobs and applying for ones I am qualified for, and I am fed up wasting extra time doing applications for jobs I have no chance of getting. They don't seem to realise that to do a top notch application for a high level job can take a good day to complete.

There is no point me even applying for minimum wage basic admin jobs, as I've only once been offered an interview, which lasted for less than two minutes as they said I was overqualified and would be bored. I've rewritten my CV to make it look like I would be willing to do these jobs (even going on the JC's CV writing course in order to write an admin based CV), but unless I out and out lie on it I will always look overqualified (I have been a journalist for the BBC for ten years then I became an English Professor). I apologise to all those in HR who have received my CV for a job I have no possibility of getting!

chewynut

On the one hand they may be trying to pull a fast one by sending it 13 times.

On the other hand, it was probably a glitch and you could be very rude to somebody who hasn't done anything to deserve it.

It absolutely sucked when I was trying to find a job when I was 19. I tried to only apply for the stuff I was qualified for but did the Job Centre or even my parents agree with that? Nope. None of them gave a crap if I wasn't anywhere near qualified for it, I should send the application anyway and waste my time and the employer's time. And I always used to get moaned at, especially by my mum (:o) when I didn't want to apply for stuff I wasn't qualified for it. She made me feel like crap for not applying for every job under the sun.

If I'd had an e-mail back saying 'I don't want you', I would've taken it personally and been upset by it. Us young people have got to start somewhere. People whine and moan about young 'uns not wanting to work but aren't willing to give them a chance to get their foot on the ladder.