MSE News: Government shrugs off Lords benefits defeat

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  • tifo
    tifo Posts: 1,918
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    Killmark wrote: »
    assuming that they have developed a good command of English and assimilated into society.

    I think you mean "integrated".

    People might not want to be "assimilated" and lose their identity. This is the same of others coming here and ex-pat Britain's living abroad.
  • sarahg1969
    sarahg1969 Posts: 6,694
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    tifo wrote: »
    No, i'm not kidding. Those that want to make something of themselves (if their parents are unemployed) have the choice to do so. There's nothing stopping them.

    Of course, there are those that want to carry on what their parents do but that's a choice they make.

    There is something stopping them, though. They see what can be achieved by a lifetime on benefits, and that may be all they aspire to, unless they have a role model elsewhere who can demonstrate the benefits of a good wortk ethic to them.
  • Killmark
    Killmark Posts: 306
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    edited 25 January 2012 at 1:37PM
    tifo wrote: »
    I think you mean "integrated".

    People might not want to be "assimilated" and lose their identity. This is the same of others coming here and ex-pat Britain's living abroad.


    Assimilation doesn't mean that you lose your identity.

    assimilate

    to bring into conformity with the customs, attitudes, etc., of a group, nation, or the like; adapt or adjust: to assimilate the new immigrants.


    as oppposed to



    integrate

    to give or cause to give
    equal opportunity and consideration to (a racial, religious, or ethnic group or a member of such a group): to integrate minority groups in the school system.
  • Everyone should get a top up to the same amount. :T

    That way, you can CHOOSE tohave a child and spend it on them, or CHOOSE to have a bigger property and spend it on that or CHOOSE to get Married or CHOOSE to invest any surplus back into businessess, or CHOOSE to have nice holidays.:)

    That would be fair wouldn't it? After all, aren't we all equal?

    Does anyone who currently receives benefits have any argument against the above?
  • tifo
    tifo Posts: 1,918
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    Everyone should get a top up to the same amount. :T

    Yep, the rest of us who EARN below £26k net should get a top up to make it equal.
  • Killmark
    Killmark Posts: 306
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    edited 25 January 2012 at 1:44PM
    Everyone should get a top up to the same amount. :T

    That way, you can CHOOSE tohave a child and spend it on them, or CHOOSE to have a bigger property and spend it on that or CHOOSE to get Married or CHOOSE to invest any surplus back into businessess, or CHOOSE to have nice holidays.:)

    That would be fair wouldn't it? After all, aren't we all equal?

    Does anyone who currently receives benefits have any argument against the above?

    Very much in favour as each household would be limited to £7,400 a year (a far better benefit cap imo)

    Pensioners wouldn't be happy though.
  • shedboy94
    shedboy94 Posts: 929 Forumite
    edited 25 January 2012 at 1:50PM
    I have 2 kids because I can afford 2 kids. Thoses on benefits keep having more children because they know the state will increase their benefits, whereas my employer will not increase my wages. More children will not mean more tax paid in the future as there are not enough jobs to accommodate everyone. DLA needs radically overhauled along with the whole benefits system - there are so many conditions DLA pays out for that beggars belief - I've seen people get DLA for their child as they have exzema for example - why would that merit a payment of DLA and also a disability premium of CTC? The whole JSA system is a joke......how can you receive it for years......surely the whole point is to receive it while SEEKING a job.......are you trying to tell me these people are applying for jobs every day and have never been offered 1 job, no matter how menial? In terms of child poverty......how does throwing money at the parents help matters - chances are they are spending it on anything but their children - clothing, food and heating vouchers would be a better option. Immigrants - in my experience, the minute they arrive in the UK, they are on the phone wanting to apply for benefits......most of the time they can't speak English, but know how to ask for a Tax Credit application form!!
  • JimmyTheWig
    JimmyTheWig Posts: 12,199
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    shedboy94 wrote: »
    More children will not mean more tax paid in the future as there are not enough jobs to accommodate everyone.
    More children will mean more demand for goods and services and so more jobs.
    I've seen people get DLA for their child as they have exzema for example - why would that merit a payment of DLA and also a disability premium of CTC?
    It would have to be very severe exzema, but it is allowed. It's an example given, even, on who can apply.
    The point is that the parent of this child is spending at least an hour a day treating their child's condition. DLA is their payment for having to do this. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but that's how they could fit the criteria.
    Immigrants - in my experience, the minute they arrive in the UK, they are on the phone wanting to apply for benefits
    An experience _not_ backed up by the _evidence_ given by a poster above.
  • LookingForNipsy
    LookingForNipsy Posts: 89 Forumite
    edited 25 January 2012 at 2:41PM
    shedboy94 wrote: »
    I have 2 kids because I can afford 2 kids. Thoses on benefits keep having more children because they know the state will increase their benefits, whereas my employer will not increase my wages. More children will not mean more tax paid in the future as there are not enough jobs to accommodate everyone. DLA needs radically overhauled along with the whole benefits system - there are so many conditions DLA pays out for that beggars belief - I've seen people get DLA for their child as they have exzema for example - why would that merit a payment of DLA and also a disability premium of CTC? The whole JSA system is a joke......how can you receive it for years......surely the whole point is to receive it while SEEKING a job.......are you trying to tell me these people are applying for jobs every day and have never been offered 1 job, no matter how menial? In terms of child poverty......how does throwing money at the parents help matters - chances are they are spending it on anything but their children - clothing, food and heating vouchers would be a better option. Immigrants - in my experience, the minute they arrive in the UK, they are on the phone wanting to apply for benefits......most of the time they can't speak English, but know how to ask for a Tax Credit application form!!

    Good for you, hopefully you're always in a position to afford your children but many benefit claimants with children started off employed, like you, and unfortunately things changed beyond their control. There are very few people who DELIBERATELY rely on benefits and unless a system is perfect they will ALWAYS exist.

    A small proportion of people are on JSA for years but the number of long time unemployed has increased since the recession hit - there is a serious dearth of jobs in this country. In this climate you can look for many many months and get nothing.

    Immigrants are less likely to claim benefits than UK nationals and are usually not even entitled to benefits "the minute they arrive in the UK".

    I agree the benefits system needs improvement but misinformation doesn't solve anything and improving the system won't do much on its own to improve the economic situation of this country. More jobs - especially better paid, more secure jobs - are needed.
  • shedboy94
    shedboy94 Posts: 929 Forumite
    More children will mean more demand for goods and services and so more jobs.


    It would have to be very severe exzema, but it is allowed. It's an example given, even, on who can apply.
    The point is that the parent of this child is spending at least an hour a day treating their child's condition. DLA is their payment for having to do this. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but that's how they could fit the criteria.


    An experience _not_ backed up by the _evidence_ given by a poster above.


    I work for Tax Credits, have done for many years so I do think I have the experience to say what I have, despite the "figures". All figures can be manipulated
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