Could this be a "FREE" car?

Flyboy152

James1968 wrote: »

Ford will soon be launching an electric Focus with a 200 mile range. If they get the price right, it will be a good commuting car.

NBLondon wrote: »

I do 75 miles a week commuting in a petrol Focus - so if I have a garage and charging point or my employer gets green tax credits for letting me charge it at work then it could well be good for commuting. Or as I said before - maybe a small business using a Focus estate for deliveries.

However, I also go on holidays to cottages in remote bits of GB more than 100 miles away, so unless there are charging options along the way; I'm going to need a petrol one for those. For the occasional trip, hiring works but there are people who commute in the city all week and then make long drives at weekends e.g. they need to visit family regularly. It doesn't work well for them as the only car.

If the range is two hundred miles, you should be able to charge when you get to the cottage.

The other thing that strikes me about charging is will the battery life be affected by the charging pattern. If you have access to a good charging point at home/work then you can run from 100% down to nearly empty and then long charge back to 100%. If you are grabbing them as and when and using a lot of quick charges, the battery may go from 100% to 50% then to 80% then to 20% with a lot of top-ups. Can a battery be designed to work/last equally well on both patterns?

I think the trend is that you lease the batteries, so they can be changed at no extra cost.

Mobeer

Flyboy152 wrote: »

I find it quite odd, the abject rejection of the thought of an electric car being used on the roads. Why are so many people so dead against them?

I am not dead-set against the idea, but in practice there is no chance of me buying one.

I have never lived anywhere that had charging facilities at home, nor worked anywhere with charging facilities at work. When I travel to friends or relatives the journey is often under 80 miles each way, but there is nowhere to charge at my friends\relatives.

For an electric car to be practical it needs:
- a step change in infrastructure, so roadside charging becomes not just possible in isolated places but a matter of routine
- a range of say 200 miles, so if for whatever reason roadside charging is not possible every journey then this does not matter

Such a situation will come eventually, but for now my car can only be 'charged' by fossil fuels.

Flyboy152

Mobeer wrote: »

I am not dead-set against the idea, but in practice there is no chance of me buying one.

I have never lived anywhere that had charging facilities at home, nor worked anywhere with charging facilities at work. When I travel to friends or relatives the journey is often under 80 miles each way, but there is nowhere to charge at my friends\relatives.

For an electric car to be practical it needs:
- a step change in infrastructure, so roadside charging becomes not just possible in isolated places but a matter of routine
- a range of say 200 miles, so if for whatever reason roadside charging is not possible every journey then this does not matter

Such a situation will come eventually, but for now my car can only be 'charged' by fossil fuels.

How do you, your friends and your relatives cope without electricity?

Mobeer

Flyboy152 wrote: »

How do you, your friends and your relatives cope without electricity?

We manage ok in flats, in houses with parking distant from the house. I park in a leased garage with no electricity and no chance to fit it.

NBLondon

Flyboy152 wrote: »

If the range is two hundred miles, you should be able to charge when you get to the cottage.

Like mobeer said - you can't guarantee that you can park with immediate access to electricity. I've seen holiday cottages where the nearest place to park is 100yds away and I don't think extension leads across the road all night is a great idea... So there have to be publicly accessible charging options - maybe at motorway services, leave the car for a top-up while you have a meal? Bet that wouldn't be free though...

I think the trend is that you lease the batteries, so they can be changed at no extra cost.

Hmmm - and who decides when you get a change? Presumably the manufacturer in the lease contract. So if your charging cycle pattern reduces the efficiency of the battery, your stuck with it until the next change or you pay for an early change. Will it be like phone contracts, if you pay more per month, can you get an annual upgrade to a new model? Or improved batteries after 3 years? If you sell on 2nd-hand, the battery lease presumably goes with the car - so buyers may need to be cautious about where they are in the life of the battery pack.

It'll be a while before you can have electric bangernomics too - how many of us have the skills to do home maintenance on these - or will they be "no user serviceable parts inside" like your telly?

Flyboy152

NBLondon wrote: »

Like mobeer said - you can't guarantee that you can park with immediate access to electricity. I've seen holiday cottages where the nearest place to park is 100yds away and I don't think extension leads across the road all night is a great idea... So there have to be publicly accessible charging options - maybe at motorway services, leave the car for a top-up while you have a meal? Bet that wouldn't be free though...

Hmmm - and who decides when you get a change? Presumably the manufacturer in the lease contract. So if your charging cycle pattern reduces the efficiency of the battery, your stuck with it until the next change or you pay for an early change. Will it be like phone contracts, if you pay more per month, can you get an annual upgrade to a new model? Or improved batteries after 3 years? If you sell on 2nd-hand, the battery lease presumably goes with the car - so buyers may need to be cautious about where they are in the life of the battery pack.

It'll be a while before you can have electric bangernomics too - how many of us have the skills to do home maintenance on these - or will they be "no user serviceable parts inside" like your telly?

Battery warranties are getting longer, if they fail to perform to specification during that time, I would say that the warranty should kick in. Beyond that, I suppose it depends on the terms of the lease.

forgotmyname

Be like most warranties. Their 200 mile estimate is in perfect conditions the warranty will probably say 60 miles is a realistic figure.

So they will be in a poor state by the time the warranty kicks in.

Leased batteries. How does that go with servicing? Must the car be dealer serviced to have the batteries inspected?

200 mile range in almost all driving conditions would need to be a minimum. But what to do when you need that longer journey?

How can i tow my caravan 350miles?

Robisere

It's a "City" car.

I live in rural Lincolnshire. There are no charging points in the East Midlands, East Anglia, or anywhere else outside London and a very few other cities.

Its greatest use would appear to be in London, our capital. Which has the finest integrated public transport system in the country, as I found on a recent holiday there. I stayed in North Finchley and Barnet and was able to go anywhere in the capital by frequent bus, Tube and Overground trains. I parked up my Focus at the hotel, and did not start it up again until I left at the holiday's end.

Those who point out the emissions factor, are ignoring the fact that the greatest quantity of our Natinal Grid power, comes from power stations which burn something. If we covered the country with wind farms and/or solar power stations, at the present rate of development, that source could not supply more than 10% of our needs.

These cars solve nothing: too small, too underpowered, low ranges in real usage, not enough charging facilities.

A small, safe, hyrdrogen engine would work much better: thermodynamically efficient and its only emission is water.