Train station overcrowding

Stigy

newfoundglory wrote: »

I'm sure you have... but you've answered your own question here - as pushing forcefully and/or fare evasion are completely different offences, and would be ones far easier to prosecute than a watery "correct manner" argument. Because its not defined, only a court could decide, and that gets too expensive for anyone to try it (not on its own anyway)

If you tailgate another passenger, the barriers will attempt to close after the fare paying passenger has passed through, thus meaning you have to force the barriers open. Unless of course you are very good at it from your previous fare evasion attempts I guess...;)

Pushing forcefully through the ticket barriers in order to exit behind another person is still a barrier offence under 9(2), unless you misunderstand me.

Byelaws are Strict Liability offences, therefore "watery" as it may seem to you, there's little or no defence. Cost is seldom a factor at the Magistrates' Court where TOCs are concerned for this very reason. Magistrates, being the lay people they are, will see the facts of the matter as they are. If TOCs can succesfully prosecute so many 18(1) and (2) Byelaws that often look "watery" as you put it, then something as straight forward and easy to figure out as how a ticket barrier should be correctly used, should be a doddle!

newfoundglory

Perhaps if the train operators employed less prosecutors who haven't got a clue what they are doing, and more proactive customer service staff we wouldn't be the mess we are in currently.

But, i'm hoping at least we accept that a barrier isn't an authorised person now. Although i'm pretty sure the "person" in there, might have been a clue :rotfl:

Strict liability has nothing to do with it - the offence is not fully defined.

Livingthedream

Humphrey10 wrote: »

Nope. And anyone (well I assume it's all staff) who does work for a TOC would get free travel, there is no 'maybe' about it.

Only free travel for the Train Company you work for and so many free trips per year on sister Train Companies ie; as in First Scotrail and First Transpennine Express.

Other Train Companies you have to pay and before anybody mentions priv cards even with their discount it's normally cheaper to buy an Advance single which isn't discounted.

Oh, newfoundglory, stigy's right by the way on everything he's stated about Byelaws and tailgating, your the one who is talking rubbish.

Jeff_Bridges_hair

Wow, I love the way he thinks that SWT would suddenly stop this mass overcrowding only if they knew there was going to be an inspection at this mysterious station with only 2 exits and one which is closed all the time.

im struggling to stop myself from laughing here.. Its not working but im trying.

Humphrey10

Livingthedream wrote: »

Only free travel for the Train Company you work for and so many free trips per year on sister Train Companies ie; as in First Scotrail and First Transpennine Express.

Other Train Companies you have to pay and before anybody mentions priv cards even with their discount it's normally cheaper to buy an Advance single which isn't discounted.

Oh, I didn't realise that, I thought it was for all operators.

I had thought when people said 'priv travel' they were talking about free (if you discount the tax) travel like ex BR staff get, are they talking about a discount card instead?

All I know for sure is I don't get any free travel

Livingthedream

Humphrey10 wrote: »

Oh, I didn't realise that, I thought it was for all operators.

I had thought when people said 'priv travel' they were talking about free (if you discount the tax) travel like ex BR staff get, are they talking about a discount card instead?

All I know for sure is I don't get any free travel

Old BR staff that haven't retired yet get protected rights and get a certain amount of free travel on all Train Companies' trains as well as their present Train Companies' travel benefits.

Priv cards which are issued to all permanent Train Company employees, give the holder a discount only on Anytime & Rover tickets but not Off Peak, Super Off Peak or Advance tickets so it can work out cheaper to forgo the discount and buy full priced Advance single.

timbo58

ONLY ex BR staff keep the right to 1/4 fare throughout and boxes (48 hours all TOCs passes), all staff after privatisation have lost these and get whatever crumbs their TOC is prepared to give them (Firstgroup bus staff get some rail provisions but rail staff don't get bus discounts!).

I used the rule regarding ticket checking by an authorised person as since a gateline is monitored by an authorised person I still believe the byelaw is breached if the ticket barrier is not used correctly, i.e. with the intent of not 'showing' the ticket.

Humphrey10

Livingthedream wrote: »

as well as their present Train Companies' travel benefits.

timbo58 wrote: »

all staff after privatisation have lost these and get whatever crumbs their TOC is prepared to give them

You don't have to work for a TOC to work in the rail industry, I'd be glad for crumbs, more than we get. 75% off a season ticket which is very useful if you travel by train to work, less useful if you only use trains for leisure travel.

Does the OP mean the station has two rows of ticket gates, rather than two exits to the station building? eg St Pancras has one row of ticket gates for the FCC services, but the station has many exits.

newfoundglory

There are two gate lines, one at each end of the station for each of the entrances.

Things have been okay for the last few days - no major queues going up the stairs and onto platform. It might be because my train has actually been running on time (!!!), and thus not arriving at the same time as another train on the opposite platform causing chaos.

There probably are enough barriers (more are actually going to be added) - its just managed really badly.

Seems a bit strange to me during rush hour to have 4 gates to exit and 3 to enter when there are at least 50+ people leaving the station for every 1 person entering it :wall:

Stigy

newfoundglory wrote: »

Strict liability has nothing to do with it - the offence is not fully defined.

Clutching at straws or what?

It's defined enough so that even imbeciles can understand what the 'correct manner' is. Clue's in the term "ticket" barriers.

I recon said station could be Surbiton, as only one side is staffed at any one time.

TOC travel facilities much depends on who you work for. I get free travel on my TOC, plus the TOC it's sistered with. Also get 75% discount on most other TOCs bar LUL and some railway in Scotland, plus 75% off on certain boats, too.