Osborne loses his nerve in the face of Union solidarity

ruggedtoast

Generali wrote: »

The teachers are a slightly different case as their pensions are funded for the most part.

The current value of civil service unfunded pensions is, IIRC, £1,000,000,000,000 (a trillion quid) and that is just the cost of putting away enough money today to make the required payments in future. With a currently accrued pension pot of £0 (no quid), the taxpayer is going to have to pony up the compound interest amount between now and retirement.

The bank bailouts (which I did not and do not support) actually cost £125,000,000,000 in loans and share purchases. Presumably a reasonable chunk of that will be repaid one way or another, although I doubt that the taxpayer will ever actually make a profit on this lunacy. It is worth noting that this was a response to a crisis.

The debt of £1,000,000,000,000 is entirely planned except, I suppose, for the rather messy bit of paying for it. There are about 29,000,000 workers in the UK. How many do you think have put aside their £35,000 share to pay for this? Have you? If you think only private sector employees should pay the unfunded part of your pension then their bill rises to around £45,000. Plus compound interest if they haven't saved up their share of your pension of course.

BTW, it's not a case of whether the employees deserve their pensions as IMO they do. They met the terms of their contracts and their employers should do the same. However, if the money isn't there to pay for this then it won't be paid.

It's a problem Generali, it's a problem. But with ingenuity and pluck and everyone pulling together, and a small amount of redistribution of wealth from the haves to the have nots, I know we can solve it!

Everyone in the UK deserves a decent, dignified retirement.

Generali

ruggedtoast wrote: »

It's a problem Generali, it's a problem. But with ingenuity and pluck and everyone pulling together, and a small amount of redistribution of wealth from the haves to the have nots, I know we can solve it!

Everyone in the UK deserves a decent, dignified retirement.

You'll have to find a lot of millionaires to make up a trillion quid. There are only about a quarter of a million of them at present (depending on who you believe). That puts you a quarter of the way there.

Everyone in the UK deserves a decent dignified retirement. The problem remains, who will you get to pay for it?

A._Badger

Generali wrote: »

You'll have to find a lot of millionaires to make up a trillion quid. There are only about a quarter of a million of them at present (depending on who you believe). That puts you a quarter of the way there.

Heavens! Don't tell old Toasty that - it's one of the myths that helps keep socialists alive: that if you soak the rich everyone can enjoy a life of luxury.

The basic maths escape the poor dears. But then we've just seen socialist maths at work during the Blair/Brown years, haven't we?

ruggedtoast

Generali wrote: »

You'll have to find a lot of millionaires to make up a trillion quid. There are only about a quarter of a million of them at present (depending on who you believe). That puts you a quarter of the way there.

Everyone in the UK deserves a decent dignified retirement. The problem remains, who will you get to pay for it?

Yes but there are a lot of assets around, most of them doing nothing for the people who own them.

We could begin by collateralising the royal family and move on from there.

geneer

Cant say I support the public sector bleating.

RJP33

A._Badger wrote: »

Heavens! Don't tell old Toasty that - it's one of the myths that helps keep socialists alive: that if you soak the rich everyone can enjoy a life of luxury.

The basic maths escape the poor dears. But then we've just seen socialist maths at work during the Blair/Brown years, haven't we?

Well the Soviet Union is a nice example of what happens when you redistribute all weath, whether earned or unearned, to the poorest. Everyone's standards fall.

Would be easier to just get pensions that are good value for the taxpayer.

macaque_2

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Actually, over 60% of the country supported public sector workers' strike action. This may not have been overly apparent to you, what with you being trapped in your Daily Mail bubble of perpetual indignation and all.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-15910621

With great disrespect to my fellow voters, I would describe them (as a group) as a bunch of fickle airheads. The evidence for this is clear from the number of times New Labour got voted back in when they were clearly wrecking the economy for short term gains. It also relates to the fact that 40,000 'voters' rated Princess Diana and John Lennon ahead of Isaac Newton in a poll of 10 Great Britons.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/2341661.stm

Support for public sector pensions will only last as long as the people think that someone else is paying for them. When the chips are down and people are losing their jobs or paying more taxes to fund special pension terms for one group in society, I suspect the poll will look very different.

ruggedtoast

The public sector workers are the backbone that makes Britain tick. British people enjoy first rate, first world, public services and are happy to pay the going rate to the men and women who teach our children, keep our towns and cities clean and orderly, and look after us when we are sick or in distress. Including their modest pensions.

Canny public sector workers know the Tories have their backs against the wall, they have given David Cameron a firm kick in the crotch and sent him away with a bloody nose.

The Tories would like to plunder Britain like a worm eating a juicy apple from the inside out, but that won't happen as long as our public sector and the unions are on watch!

A._Badger

ruggedtoast wrote: »

The public sector workers are the backbone that makes Britain tick. British people enjoy first rate, first world, public services and are happy to pay the going rate to the men and women who teach our children, keep our towns and cities clean and orderly, and look after us when we are sick or in distress. Including their modest pensions.

Canny public sector workers know the Tories have their backs against the wall, they have given David Cameron a firm kick in the crotch and sent him away with a bloody nose.

The Tories would like to plunder Britain like a worm eating a juicy apple from the inside out, but that won't happen as long as our public sector and the unions are on watch!

I see they've broken out the Christmas sherry early, down at the Ministry of Lost Causes.

RJP33

ruggedtoast wrote: »

The public sector workers are the backbone that makes Britain tick. British people enjoy first rate, first world, public services and are happy to pay the going rate to the men and women who teach our children, keep our towns and cities clean and orderly, and look after us when we are sick or in distress. Including their modest pensions.

Canny public sector workers know the Tories have their backs against the wall, they have given David Cameron a firm kick in the crotch and sent him away with a bloody nose.

The Tories would like to plunder Britain like a worm eating a juicy apple from the inside out, but that won't happen as long as our public sector and the unions are on watch!

Despite all the anti-Tory rhetoric (I have no idea why it's in there) you'll probably find if you compare our public services to other countries the taxpayer gets very poor value for money.