Labour and the Euro summit

Really2

StevieJ wrote: »

You would think that the UK independence party would be cheering from the rafters.

TBF it has most probably cost them a fair few voters if people think the conservatives are standing up to europe.

Sir_Humphrey

Cameron has achieved nothing. The other countries can do what they like without any UK influence on events. No powers have been repatriated; the City has not been "protected".

Ironically, I am not a fan of what the Eurozone wants, due to the bone-headed Austerity rules. But those would not survive centre-left govts in France and Germany, both of which are likely within the next two years.

I don't think a lot of people have twigged that the UK have lost this one and then done a flounce.

Malcolm.

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

Cameron has achieved nothing.

To the contrary. Cameron's sent the message that the UK is not going to surrender UK interests without a fight, despite the peer pressure.

It's a pity the labour government didn't do this - they surrendered the UKs hard fought rebate all too willingly.

Sir_Humphrey

Malcolm. wrote: »

To the contrary. Cameron's sent the message that the UK is not going to surrender UK interests without a fight, despite the peer pressure.

It's a pity the labour government didn't do this - they surrendered the UKs hard fought rebate all too willingly.

But that is exactly what has happened. They can just ignore us now.

If you want to get Party-Political, Labour (specifically Brown and Balls) kept us out of the Euro. THAT is an actual achievement.

And why is sticking up to the City a good thing anyway? I thought people here 1) liked austerity and 2) disliked bankers. Cameron backed the bankers and rejected austerity rules.

Malcolm.

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

But that is exactly what has happened. They can just ignore us now.

If the UK backtracked when it disagreed with a treaty, this is effectively the same as being ignored.

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

If you want to get Party-Political, Labour (specifically Brown and Balls) kept us out of the Euro. THAT is an actual achievement.

You mean they chose not to join. It's different to keeping us out. The default is with the euro is no change, i.e. not join.

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

And why is sticking up to the City a good thing anyway? I thought people here 1) liked austerity and 2) disliked bankers. Cameron backed the bankers and rejected austerity rules.

Not me. You've got the wrong person. I'm pro the finance industry, on condition the reguators get it right. Unfortunately Brown's three tier system didn't.

Sir_Humphrey

Another point. The Euro-sceptics think we can now renegotiate our relationship. Well, that is not correct because we have thrown away all our cards. Cameron should never have boxed himself into the corner he found himself in.

The choice now is to stay in the single market, with little influence on European policy. Or leave, and still have to play along with EU rules to trade with them, just as Norway and Switzerland do (I have professional experience in this).

This is not an issue to play silly games with.

Graham_Devon

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

If you want to get Party-Political, Labour (specifically Brown and Balls) kept us out of the Euro. THAT is an actual achievement.

Erm, so has Cameron and Clegg.

I.e. they haven't joined either.

ILW

Are European countries going to refuse to buy our goods because of this. If not, what is the problem?

Sir_Humphrey

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Erm, so has Cameron and Clegg.

I.e. they haven't joined either.

The time we might have joined was when it was founded - under Brown's watch as Chancellor.

The really crazy thing is that the Euro agreement is actually rather right-wing; formulated by the French and German equivalents of the Tories. Cameron has actually p!$$ed all over people who should be his allies.

Bizarre!

Graham_Devon

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

Another point. The Euro-sceptics think we can now renegotiate our relationship. Well, that is not correct because we have thrown away all our cards. Cameron should never have boxed himself into the corner he found himself in.

The choice now is to stay in the single market, with little influence on European policy. Or leave, and still have to play along with EU rules to trade with them, just as Norway and Switzerland do (I have professional experience in this).

This is not an issue to play silly games with.

What cards did we have exactly?

With this ever closer dictatorship type EU, what cards could we have played?

There are no deals to be made. It's our way, or the highway. That's it. We tried negotiating. We were open to negotiations. However, the EU wasn't. It was either join them, and do as they say, or don't.

Frankly, I'm glad were not part of that.

However, I do fear it may have repercusions (sp) down the line, as the venom shown towards the UK today for not abiding by "the rules" was pretty evident.

I have no doubt in my mind that the EU will get the UK back, in whatever way they can. As I say, it's looking more like a dictatorship with every week that passes. The scorn shown, and the words written today just back this up. I just fear the end result of this, as Sarkozy is already blaming London for all of the EU's woes. Something he has only done after vetoeing.