sent home from work in the night

Sambucus_Nigra

Emmzi wrote: »

You are living in a century where big brave men patronise fragile ickle women. While covertly undermining perceptions of the woman's competence, strength, independence. So covertly, you probably don;'t even realise you've been indoctrinated into doing it.

Sometimes I would like help or a white knight. Myself, I will ask if I would like help. And will help people of either gender who ask. But I won't speak for other women because making sweeping generalisation about huge numbers of people is not helpful. (Who'd let a woman walk home alone? Depends on the woman.)

Assumptions about helplessness, and that is what they are, IMHO are unhelpful and perpetuate gender stereotypes.

I have had long debates with women about "your rights are now enshrined in law, get on with living a good life." I'm not a bra burner, marcher, hire by quota kind of a person.

And then sometimes I'm saddened by just how far we are from equailty as a society.

Erm, I'm a female and I distinctly remember saying I'd never let a friend walk home at midnight. Male, female - either. I can't see what that's got to do with competence, strength or independence. It's about looking after your chums, isn't it?

I am aware they could walk home on their own, but I'd rather they got home safe.

Feminism isn't about putting yourself or others at risk; it's about knowing you could if you wanted to, but choosing not to. I'd have thought you'd have known that. Or are you just trying to be argumentative?

Emmzi

Sambucus_Nigra wrote: »

Ignoring the fact that it's the employer/employee relationship - what man would let a woman walk home at midnight without at least trying to sort out transport or let them call a lift?

I wouldn't let any of my friends do it; unless the circumstances were that it was wholly safe. And even so, I'd have been getting them to text me when they got home. It's about being careful, isn't it?

What MAN would let a WOMAN walk home at midnight.

Gender stereotyping.

Also,

http://www.derailingfordummies.com/#hostile


No. I am not just being argumentative. There is a genuine inequality, and it is being perpetuated. Whether you see yourself as marginalised or not, that is not the experience of millions of other women.

Sambucus_Nigra

Emmzi wrote: »

What MAN would let a WOMAN walk home at midnight.

Gender stereotyping.

As an example because that's the subject of the thread. Or is that too hard for you to grasp. The Manager was a man and the Employee was a woman. Hence, the above line.

In general - I'd not let anyone walk home at night. Which is why we have 2 spare double beds and the number of the local taxi firms.

Emmzi

Sambucus_Nigra wrote: »

Feminism isn't about putting yourself or others at risk; it's about knowing you could if you wanted to, but choosing not to. I'd have thought you'd have known that. Or are you just trying to be argumentative?

Feminism: I do not think that word means what you think it means. I think you are confusing it with freedom of choice.

Emmzi

Sambucus_Nigra wrote: »

As an example because that's the subject of the thread. Or is that too hard for you to grasp. The Manager was a man and the Employee was a woman. Hence, the above line.

In general - I'd not let anyone walk home at night. Which is why we have 2 spare double beds and the number of the local taxi firms.

It is hard for me to grasp because that is not what you wrote. Perhaps you should choose your words differently if they are not saying what you mean. That, however, does not make me stupid. I am only reading what is written.

ceridwen

The thing is - equality or no equality - its about as unrealistic to say "No extra need for safety precautions for a woman getting home at night" as it is to say "Woman can lift just as much as men". Some things are down to "biology" rather than "the culture we are living in" and the possibility of men attacking women for the purposes of rape, etc are greater than of women attacking men for the exact same purposes.

Thats how it is - and one has to adapt accordingly.

I believe much more strongly than many in equality and pity help employers who've tried to pay me less than a man, for instance, in the past - but one cannot argue with Mother Nature (she/he/it wins every time).

Note to self: must try lifting as much as the "male" safe limit, drink as much as the "male" safe limit and deliberately go out for walks at midnight just to see if I AM safe.....:cool:. ...just to prove a point and stick two fingers up to Mother Nature then shall I?:cool:

Emmzi

one is cultural

one is biological

and one can be changed without steroids, the other can't.

Not the same thing.

lemontart

Sambucus_Nigra wrote: »

Whilst I agree that the employer doesn't have any duty of care after telling a staff member to leave the premises; we ALL have duties under the Health and Safety at Work act, and any human who sends a staff member to walk home at midnight without giving them the ability to call for a lift could be said not to have been taking their H&S into account.

The first duty of the Act says '
(1)It shall be the duty of every employer to ensure, so far as is reasonably practicable, the health, safety and welfare at work of all his employees.'



Note, it doesn't say 'in the workplace'. I think it could be argued that it is reasonably practicable to allow an employee to wait on the premises for their lift to arrive. Unless, that is, they themselves are a risk to other employees.

I fully expect a million and one people to object to this post; however as an employer I'd never have let a staff member, let alone a female one, leave work at midnight and walk home. Even if they had been a right royal PITA.

No where in original post does op state that she was not allowed to wait o/s it appears she took the decision to start walking.

ceridwen

lemontart wrote: »

No where in original post does op state that she was not allowed to wait o/s it appears she took the decision to start walking.

Have you read onto the point yet where OP states she was previously attacked at workplace? Hence not wanting to hang around..

dickydonkin

I think some are drifting off a little here focusing on the merits of equality.

I am still of the belief that it was irresponsible for the EMPLOYER to place an employee - (irrspective of the gender) in a potentially dangerous situation and I still believe a duty of care was breached. I don't care what the circumstances were prior to the 'eviction' - unless security or safety was going to be compromised, then the OP should have been allowed to summon assistance from the safety of the workplace.

I appreciate that some people will have no qualms about walking home in the early hours of the morning - but some (many) will - and that applies to both sexes.

Strange though it may seem to some - we are all different.