Student - JSA, grants, & living with grandparents

terryw

Birkee,

I have read this thread with interest. Might I be permitted to offer some opinion, bearing in mind that I am completely disinterested.

I commend you for looking after your grandchild. Well done. I am pleased that the young man is doing well and has much to recommend him, probably because of your influence.

Comparisons with others - asylum seekers or benefit claimants - are not helpful. They are just making you angry. This comparison really serves no useful purpose for your own situation.

You have been lapse in not claiming child benefit and other benefits (possibly) in the past. This is is purely down to you.

Look at the current situation. Yes, the information asked is intrusive. But if you require financial help from the government, then it is required.

It is your choice really. Take the advice given by the posters above, or don't - and continue to moan about your situation.

bw, regardless

birkee

terryw wrote: »

Birkee,

I have read this thread with interest. Might I be permitted to offer some opinion, bearing in mind that I am completely disinterested.

I commend you for looking after your grandchild. Well done. I am pleased that the young man is doing well and has much to recommend him, probably because of your influence.

Comparisons with others - asylum seekers or benefit claimants - are not helpful. They are just making you angry. This comparison really serves no useful purpose for your own situation.

You have been lapse in not claiming child benefit and other benefits (possibly) in the past. This is is purely down to you.

Look at the current situation. Yes, the information asked is intrusive. But if you require financial help from the government, then it is required.

It is your choice really. Take the advice given by the posters above, or don't - and continue to moan about your situation.

bw, regardless

Pretty fair summary terryw, but of course, things are not always as straightforward as they seem.
When my Grandson sought refuge with us, we thought it was just a temporary thing. Also, his Mother would have been getting the benefits, so we couldn't claim them as well could we?
Also of course, being older, I thought child benefits etc stopped at the age of 16, and he became 17 two weeks after arriving on our doorstep.

Then when he appeared to be settling in for the duration, we looked after him untill he was 18, and was entitled to JSA, expecting him to look for work as soon as possible.

Then he decided to go to college, and signed up for a two year course....fair enough.....but he didn't ask us if he could, or if we would support him for another two years after that. He just did it.

Then there is the colleges 'open plan office' layout, which has a 'student finances' desk on the edge of the main corridor. The thought of having my bank statement available to all and sundry, including lecturers, students, visitors, and passing would be cloak room robbers, makes me extremely reluctant to submit them.

I accept this means he won't get a grant, but which is more important? His grant, or the risk of getting my account cleaned out, and personal details being sold on the open market?

Give me a closed secure office, and I might reconsider.

terryw

I don't know if the situation is different in Scotland, but in England the calculation and administration of grants is dealt with by the local authority and not the college itself. The college may well have various advisers but that is a caring role rather than an administrative one.

In any case, I am sure that if you raised your privacy concerns with whoever deals with grant calculations they would be sympathetic and arrange for the documents to be perused in privacy. You are perhaps over- reacting to the threat of your account being cleaned out. My bank account number and sort code etc is available to many people - it is on all the cheques that I have issued in the past.

It was remiss of your grandson to just sign up for a college course without discussing it with you - but whilst this is a niggle for you to sort out with him, it has no real bearing on the grant application.
Personally, I would be quite pleased that he has made the initiative to try and improve himself.

bw

easy

birkee wrote: »

Then there is the colleges 'open plan office' layout, which has a 'student finances' desk on the edge of the main corridor. The thought of having my bank statement available to all and sundry, including lecturers, students, visitors, and passing would be cloak room robbers, makes me extremely reluctant to submit them.

Whilst I appreciate thet we all have to be aware of the risks to our personal information, I do think you have this worry somewhat out of proportion. Don't you think that many, many students have submitted this kind of information to the college, this year and every year? Have you heard any reports in the local news of a rash of people having their bank accounts raided/identities stolen after applying for grants ? The college will be registered under the Data Protection Act, and will have procedures in place to keep such information secure.

birkee wrote: »

I accept this means he won't get a grant, but which is more important? His grant, or the risk of getting my account cleaned out, and personal details being sold on the open market?

If failure to get a grant ends up with him quitting the course, not improving his education, and hence affecting his future life/career/income, then frankly his grant is FAR more important than the slight/possible risk of your bank account details being stolen.

Oldernotwiser

terryw wrote: »

I don't know if the situation is different in Scotland, but in England the calculation and administration of grants is dealt with by the local authority and not the college itself. The college may well have various advisers but that is a caring role rather than an administrative one.

In any case, I am sure that if you raised your privacy concerns with whoever deals with grant calculations they would be sympathetic and arrange for the documents to be perused in privacy. You are perhaps over- reacting to the threat of your account being cleaned out. My bank account number and sort code etc is available to many people - it is on all the cheques that I have issued in the past.

It was remiss of your grandson to just sign up for a college course without discussing it with you - but whilst this is a niggle for you to sort out with him, it has no real bearing on the grant application.
Personally, I would be quite pleased that he has made the initiative to try and improve himself.

bw

Since the withdrawal of ALG, funds for adult learners are discretionary and come from the college, like they always used to.

Apart from that, I totally agree with your post.

Voyager2002

custardy wrote: »

its not an opinion
its a fact based on experience
learn the difference

It may have been a fact at the time, but rules and systems change. The fact that college courses were funded in one way a few years ago is no help to the OP if the rules are now different.

Voyager2002

birkee wrote: »

They ask to see proof of income, but won't accept my pension statements, but WILL accept pay slips.
You tell me the difference! Except pay slips can be less than 3 months old.
They don't want bank statements, from people supplying pay slips.

And oldernotwiser, what do the Inland Revenue do, if not assess your income and bank accounts for tax purposes?
Where do secret incomes come into it? And would you put unexplained incomes, into your everyday current bank account?
I still think it is bloody minded they won't accept my pension statements, and you've mentioned other people having examined my finances to judge qualification. Would YOU put all your banking details into the college system to be looked at by multiple people.
There's a black market in just names and addresses, imagine the money you'd get for all the bank details to go with it.

All they have to do is pop them in the photocopier (which they will probably do anyway.) and they could end up anywhere. Do they make college staff legally responsible for data in their possession? Or is the girl at the front desk just anybody off the street, qualified to do the work? (In our college, she sits on a public corridor anyway, where confidential paper could be left on the desk for ANYBODY to see. There is NO security!)

The rules on data protection are extremely strict: for details, find the website for the Information Commissioner. Organisations that ask for confidential information (such as bank statements in this situation) are obliged to keep the information private, and that means that they are obliged to have effective systems to process it without the possibility of abuse. Only specific members of staff are allowed to see your data, and yes, those individuals are legally responsible for treating it properly and maintaining your confidentiality.

Did you contact the college principal to say that you were concerned about whether they would protect your privacy? I hope and expect that, had you done so, you would have been given a satisfactory response.

custardy

Voyager2002 wrote: »

It may have been a fact at the time, but rules and systems change. The fact that college courses were funded in one way a few years ago is no help to the OP if the rules are now different.

little late to the party but I linked to the current data showing the same.
what does the post I have quoted add?

birkee

That's it!
News report on TV this morning regarding identity theft.
Chap on there, was at a hotel, and had his wallet stolen at lunchtime. By 4pm they had cleaned out HIS accounts, AND his Wife's accounts, and they were left penniless. (No PIN number in the wallet either!)
I know! ..... how did they get his Wife's accounts? I've no idea, but that's what he said.

Another item on the same broadcast. Elderly man gave a publishing company(?) his account details to pay for an advertisement for his cottage to let in France, and they cleaned out his account of 11K, taking up to SIX payments per day to avoid large withdrawals.

Put my bank statements into an unknown system?
Looks like my pension will be keeping my Grandson for two more years.
(How many more systems need to see bank statements by the way?)

shop-to-drop

Just blank out all the account numbers sort code etc just leave all the info they need like income. But if you'd rather not apply at all that is your choice. Hope your grandson does well with his course and appreciates your support.