Student - JSA, grants, & living with grandparents

gardenpath

If he were to get the grant, would he then pay you for rent and living expenses? Since presumably he has no real outgoings then really the grant is bring paid to you, via him, which is why the college want to check you're not a secret millionaire. They are paying him a grant so he can start the road to becoming independent from you... and that starts with paying rent, share of utilities bills, food etc. You are well within your rights to blank out sensitive information, ie account number and sort code before sending the information in.

He sounds like a genuinely nice person, with the voluntary work etc so I'm sure he wouldn't mind pulling his weight around the house? At 19 he shouldn't need much looking after.

birkee

Thanks to all who have now shown a little understanding, and you do have some valuable points.

Just for further information regarding the situation. His Mother, my Daughter is bipolar, and lives in Scotland following a second marriage. She was divorced from my Grandsons Father when my Grandson was still a toddler
His Father doesn't particularly want to know, (Not that I can blame him.) and my Grandson fled his Mothers home in Scotland because he couldn't cope with the bipolar problem any more. She now considers we have stolen her Son from her.

All in all, perhaps I will draw in my annoyance, and will submit my bank account details, now someone has contributed the idea that I CAN blank out innapplicable information, such as account numbers. More importantly, things like details of my credit card payments etc, which I consider none of their business. There is just so much information available from a bank statement, and most of it is none of their business.
Why my pension statements available at the start of the payment year will not do, is in my mind, bloody minded. They may come out for April, but they are not going to change over the year are they? They want to know my income, and all other of my financial details are none of their business, after all, for parents applying for a grant, they just have to produce payslips, which just gives their income for three months. They don't have to reveal whether they are thousands of pounds in debt, or have a million pounds in the bank do they? Or who I make payments to, who supplies our gas/electricity, how much we pay in Council tax to whom, whether I pay for my TV licence monthly, etc etc etc.
Perhaps it's this that I have been rebelling against.
I'll give it some more thought,.... maybe!

thorsoak

birkee wrote: »

I have to agree with some points here, but some of you are completely wrong.

We accepted responsibility for our Grandson until he was 18, when he was elliglible to be independant via work.
From 18, he enrolled in a course with the Princes Trust, and completed that. Not only that, he then did voluntary work afterwards, painting park benches, building a garden on an OAP home etc, (and had to put up with comments from 'older not wiser' people making comments thinking they were offenders doing community service.
Then he decided he wanted to go to college, and they make me financially responsible for his keep. When does my financial responsibility for his keep end?
And as for the snide comment about my bank statements concealing embarrassing evidence. (bestpud)What stupidity! The bank would also have that evidence.
The objection was to making him MY financial responsibilty, instead of treating him as an adult, who was unemployed, and wanted to go to college.
As soon as I provide my bank statements, I accept responsibility immediately, and that means I'm responsible forever.
Perhaps it was too much, to expect him to set about making his own life, and earning his own income, but what I didn't expect, was to stretch my pension three ways while he went through college.

And yes, in response to another post, he is using the money he saved whilst he was on JSA, but that won't last for long.

And for the smart as*es who made comments about morality.
I'm registered disabled, and have difficulty standing, and my Wife has had two heart bypasses, the second of which she barely survived, she also receives a small DLA, yet our morality is questioned about looking after a Grandson?
We are having trouble looking after ourselves, without the cooking, washing, and cleaning for a third person.

It looks as though he will just have to pack up college, and live gord knows where on JSA.
Thanks for the 'holier than thou' points of view people.

Your grandson is aged 19?/20? He should be looking after you - not you and your wife who are disabled looking after him. He is fit, he is healthy, he has worked via the Princes Trust, so therefore he will know how to operate a vacuum cleaner/washing machine/iron - he can learn to cook, even if he cannot cook at the moment, and he could shop for you all.

This is 2011 - young men should be able to look afte themselves, not expect grandparents to run around after them!

And btw - by sending in bank statements, you would not be accepting responsibility for him for ever - all you would be doing is the same as his parents would, were he still living with them - showing what the family income is. No more, no less.

Come down off your high horse and live in the real world - sad as it is, that is what we all have to do!

birkee

thorsoak wrote: »

Your grandson is aged 19?/20? He should be looking after you - not you and your wife who are disabled looking after him. He is fit, he is healthy, he has worked via the Princes Trust, so therefore he will know how to operate a vacuum cleaner/washing machine/iron - he can learn to cook, even if he cannot cook at the moment, and he could shop for you all.

This is 2011 - young men should be able to look afte themselves, not expect grandparents to run around after them!

And btw - by sending in bank statements, you would not be accepting responsibility for him for ever - all you would be doing is the same as his parents would, were he still living with them - showing what the family income is. No more, no less.

Come down off your high horse and live in the real world - sad as it is, that is what we all have to do!

But it doesn't just show what the family income is, does it? Wage slips don't either. Multiple jobs, two people working etc.

It's this blasted documents less than three months old problem.
My pension statements are ONE off, at the start of each financial year, they are as true on day 364, as they are on day 1.
Why will they not accept those?
The pension will not change until the next financial year, and then in April next year, the statements will be less than three months old, and may be acceptable. Why not this years?
Jobsworths?

Oldernotwiser

birkee wrote: »

But it doesn't just show what the family income is, does it? Wage slips don't either. Multiple jobs, two people working etc.

It's this blasted documents less than three months old problem.
My pension statements are ONE off, at the start of each financial year, they are as true on day 364, as they are on day 1.
Why will they not accept those?
The pension will not change until the next financial year, and then in April next year, the statements will be less than three months old, and may be acceptable. Why not this years?
Jobsworths?

But someone's bank statements will show if they have more money coming in from other sources than that shown on the pension slips. This is particularly important as you don't seem to be on any means tested benefits so nobody else would have assessed your income.

In fact, thinking about it, this may be the reason for your situation. When I used to be based in a college, if someone who was on means tested benefits wanted to receive financial help, all they needed to show was proof of what they were receiving, as someone else would have assessed their financial situation for their claim. On the other hand, someone on a low income needed to show the sort of information you've been asked for as otherwise there was only the individual's word to go on.

Would this explain your situation?

thorsoak

There is an old, old saying "them as pays the piper, calls the tune!"

If your grandson is to obtain funding for his education from the state, then the state is entitled to ask for whatever it wishes in order to satisfy the need for information about the income of the family. So, if you wish to take advantage of the funding, you supply ALL the information needed - if you choose not to, then you choose not to obtain the funding.

birkee

They ask to see proof of income, but won't accept my pension statements, but WILL accept pay slips.
You tell me the difference! Except pay slips can be less than 3 months old.
They don't want bank statements, from people supplying pay slips.

And oldernotwiser, what do the Inland Revenue do, if not assess your income and bank accounts for tax purposes?
Where do secret incomes come into it? And would you put unexplained incomes, into your everyday current bank account?
I still think it is bloody minded they won't accept my pension statements, and you've mentioned other people having examined my finances to judge qualification. Would YOU put all your banking details into the college system to be looked at by multiple people.
There's a black market in just names and addresses, imagine the money you'd get for all the bank details to go with it.

All they have to do is pop them in the photocopier (which they will probably do anyway.) and they could end up anywhere. Do they make college staff legally responsible for data in their possession? Or is the girl at the front desk just anybody off the street, qualified to do the work? (In our college, she sits on a public corridor anyway, where confidential paper could be left on the desk for ANYBODY to see. There is NO security!)

birkee

thorsoak wrote: »

There is an old, old saying "them as pays the piper, calls the tune!"

If your grandson is to obtain funding for his education from the state, then the state is entitled to ask for whatever it wishes in order to satisfy the need for information about the income of the family. So, if you wish to take advantage of the funding, you supply ALL the information needed - if you choose not to, then you choose not to obtain the funding.

Funny! I thought I had spent my whole working life paying the piper, but I don't get ANY say in the tune it seems.

Mind you, if I had spent my life on benefits, they would probably come round to my local authority house carrying bags of cash.

baza52

At the end of the day you either supply the info they are asking for or you dont.
If you choose not to then noone can help you any further.

It may be wrong in your eyes but thats how the system works.

Oldernotwiser

birkee wrote: »

And oldernotwiser, what do the Inland Revenue do, if not assess your income and bank accounts for tax purposes?
Where do secret incomes come into it? And would you put unexplained incomes, into your everyday current bank account?
I still think it is bloody minded they won't accept my pension statements, and you've mentioned other people having examined my finances to judge qualification.)

Sorry, this is just silly.

It's not a question of secret money and paying tax doesn't come into it.

You must see that just showing them your pension information wouldn't preclude you from having another pension, interest bearing investments or even earnings - all of which would go into your everyday bank account but wouldn't be known about if you just gave your pension details.

I'm afraid that you're going totally OTT about this information; it's your choice to be like this but don't expect your grandson to receive means tested funding unless you're prepared to prove that your income warrants it.