Any experiences with Electric Showers?

GDB2222

FireWyrm wrote: »

Thanks Dave...

Ah bloody hell, no wonder you can't get an electrician for love nor money, they're all running around doing DIY and busy informing the council about all those little household upgrades that they might want to take into account when they reband for council tax.

This sounds like nothing more than a money making scheme for electricians. I appreciate that I know nothing about electrics, but that doesn't mean that no one in the family does and therefore couldn't do the work if they were available. But this regulation means that you can do anything in your own house presumably.

Anyway, thanks for the reassurances...I've been watching too much cowboy builders and it's hard to know if what you're being told is true if you know nothing about the subject in the first place.

All work in bathrooms and kitchens does now need to be done by a qualified electrician. Other work, eg change light switches, can be done by anyone competent.

The price you quoted sounds fair to me, depending how far it is from your fuse board to the new shower. BTW: if it's in the bathroom and you are moving all the plumbing round anyway, why are you having an electric shower? They give very poor water flow. Why not a power shower off your main hot water system?

GDB2222

BTW, a power shower does not require a special electricity feed.

Aquatronixjenny

Ah, ok - got it.

Having a combi makes all the difference.

Yes - you will need an electric shower as you have no header tank and you can't feed a stand alone pump with mains water.

That's why combi boilers aren't really designed for bigger houses, they are ok in flats but just not practical for houses unless you spend mega bucks on getting a really good one. Have you had the boiler serviced recently to make sure there isn't a fault with it?

Yes, for an Electric shower (not power shower) you DO need a separate spur from the fuse box which also means involving either a sparky or a plumber who has a part P qualification. OP, have you had a browse through the local ads to see if there are any plumbers who have part P? That would mean you don't have to use 2 contractors and will save you £££s. Apart from that, get another couple of quotes as £900 seems a lot for labour only for just moving a bath and doing a bit of tiling. Get a fully inclusive quote for materials too.

GDB2222

FireWyrm wrote: »

Hi all. The reason we went for an electric shower is the same reason we need a shower in the first place. This house is a Victorian terrace and is split over 4 levels, the bathroom is off the 3rd level. We have fine cold water pressure, but almost no hot water pressure off the combi boiler. It takes a little bit less than the age of the universe to run a sodding bath! We originally wanted a 'power shower' since I had misunderstood the term...it's a shower and it has power was my thinking until I hit google and found out that you need a tank for that...which we don't have...alarmingly, the plumber didn't know this either or he would have corrected me instead of letting me ramble on about power showers...

So, after some investigation, it seems that we need something that heats as it goes from the cold water feed which is in fact an electric shower. We picked up a Mira Sport 9.5Kw from B&Q for £165 and after asking the blokes there, it seemed to be no difference between that and a 10.8kw. Certainly not enough to warrant an extra £100. Unfortunately, we know nothing about plumbing and so asked a plumber to advise a quote, which is where we are up to so far.

No, no, no! And I really mean, no!

A typical combi boiler is 20-30Kw. So, it will deliver 2 - 3 times as much hot water as an electric shower. When delivering hot water, it stops heating the radiators, so you get the full 20-30Kw for your shower. Your combi runs off the mains pressure which will be fine for a shower. And, yes, of course it's NBG for filling a bath, as 20-30Kw will be bound to be terribly slow. No normal combi is any good for baths, unless you have the patience of a saint. But it's fine for a shower, or at least miles better than any electric shower.

So, all you want to do is:
1. Return the electric shower for a refund, or ebay it.
2. Find a different plumber
3. Switch your bathroom round, and connect a plain shower mixer to the hot and cold water feeds.

Like I said, definitely find a new plumber who understands this.

FireWyrm

Thanks Aqua.

We have just moved in to this house. I knew the boiler was old and so a service was stipulated as part of the sale. The service was carried out and I was satisfied, but I just didn't know about the crappy pressure. The plumber we asked for the quote also does boilers and he advised a more powerful boiler which willmhave to be done I guess, but not right now. As it is, I had to borrow the £2K from the parents in law to do this much. I was planning to replace the combi in the near future, probably summer next year, but having struggled with just a bath, I can't standnit another month! I have tonhave something done. Appreciated that your advice is to get more quotes, but so far, of the 10 phone calls I've made so far, 5 didn't want to know, 3 were interested but copuldnt possibly do anything for the next 6 weeks at least and the last two quoted. The first quote was 2k+ for labour alone, and this one who initially said he would supply the spark as part of the quote, but when we got the written estimate, it was clear the spark was not included. I rang him and asked for clarification and it seems that the spark is a mate of his with the necessary qualification and would cost an additional £300 + VAT. The plumber told me it would be 3 days work to do the bathroom, so going by that, I wish I could earn £300 a day.

I'll try to get another quote. We have the shower, the tiles and the shower blind, so I jus need the bath switched with the sink so it's against the wall. All the plumbing nuts and bolts are there already. As far as I can tell, he just has to move the bath, chop into the wall to run the pipes and re-tile it. I agree, £900 seems a bit excessive, but I've always believed that you get what you pay for...it's a balancing act between not getting ripped off and getting a decent job done.

FireWyrm

GDB, I don't understand. When you turn on the hot tap, the water takes some time to heat first of all and then comes out as a medium trickle...how is this enough pressure to lift hot water another 5 feet into the air for a shower? I thought the electric shower heats hot water immediately and since the cold comes out like a pressure hose, you end up with hot and strong feed?

I'm worried now. I don't know what to do. I can return the shower to B&Q obviously, but all I want is a reasonable amount of hot water from a shower, Im not fussed how it happens. What is likely to happen if we try to fit the electric shower? Will it even work?

Looking at the documents for the combi, it says 26.3kw heat output, 12.2 bar max burner and 8 bar max water pressure. Water flow rate is 9.8 its/min. It's a Baxi 80E

zagfles

FireWyrm wrote: »

GDB, I don't understand. When you turn on the hot tap, the water takes some time to heat first of all and then comes out as a medium trickle...how is this enough pressure to lift hot water another 5 feet into the air for a shower? I thought the electric shower heats hot water immediately and since the cold comes out like a pressure hose, you end up with hot and strong feed?

You don't get a strong feed from electric showers because they restrict the water flow so that it gets a chance to heat it - the temperature dial on them works by restricting the flow - the hotter you want it the weaker the flow. If you like to be blasted by water then an electric shower won't work, you'll need some sort of pumped system from pre-heated water.

Having said that I've got 2 electric showers, 8.5Kw, and they are fine for us - the flow is quite sufficient even for my wife who likes it hot:)

But you will need an electrician to install, and it may not be an easy job as it needs a separate circuit to the fuse box. Showers take very high current so they can't simply be spurred off an existing circuit like a light or plug could. A 9.5Kw will probably need 10mm cable which is hard to work with, but I think this depends on cable routing like whether it's going through insulation, cavity walls, trunking etc.

sonastin

I deliberately had an electric shower installed after my boiler packed up for the 3rd time - I liked the concept of a separate source of hot water. On the 4th and 5th occasions that my boiler packed up, it was a godsend! (Despite having replaced every part I'd ever heard of in a boiler, 5th time was enough for a new boiler!)

Things worth bearing in mind...
the heating element won't like hard water - if you are in a hard water area it might not be the best option.
despite living in one of the softest water areas in the country, my first electric shower still managed to throw in the towel in about 13 months. Make sure you keep the receipt so you can return it if yours packs up in less time than that. (my parents had theirs for 20+ years so its not guaranteed that it will fail, but be prepared...!)

FireWyrm

Ok, now I'm thoroughly confused. What's a thermostatic shower then?

Is there a consensus of opinion in what we should do given that we have an elderly combi (specs above), no header tank, limited cash.

anselld

FireWyrm wrote: »

GDB, I don't understand. When you turn on the hot tap, the water takes some time to heat first of all and then comes out as a medium trickle...how is this enough pressure to lift hot water another 5 feet into the air 0E

Combi runs at mains pressure, same as the cold supply, so if flow is inadequate it is because it is old, possible filled with scale etc.

So, whilst combi should theoretically be better as mentioned above, the electric might be cheaper than a new boiler if you can get a reasonable quote.