Can I refuse to pay the water bill?

Sybarite

I've been in my rented flat for a few years. Recently the letting agent changed at the behest of the LL. About 8 months after the change a bill for water arrived in the post - I've never paid this utility before it's always been part of the service charge in the rent & was negotiated as such.

I can't get out of not paying this additional utility, which I regard as an unofficial rent increase, as it's in my new contract. It's underhand and the LA knows it is but there's not much I can do about it.

However my contention is with the method via which this new bill is derived. Basically the LA just divides the bill for the total block equally by the number of flats & creates an invoice, irrespective of the size of the properties or number occupants (both vary within the block).

Having checked with the water supplier I find that the annual bill I'm expected to pay via this method is £150 over the estimate for normal usage for a property of the size I'm in & the number of people who reside there. I'm a lowish user of water, rather than average, as I always take showers never baths, in which case I'm subsidizing other people's usage by nearly £200 PA.

Does anyone know what the situation is regarding a single water meter being split and billed in this way? The situation seems terribly unfair. I'd be happy with a meter but apparently (& surprisingly it's a newish block) these haven't been installed.

Any suggestions - all thoughts appreciated. The LA are absolute b******ds & are always thinking of ways to try and claw more money out of me.

silvercar

if you signed a new tenancy that stated how the water bill would be calculated therre is little you can do. You may consider it an underhand way of having a rent increase but , if you knew that the new contract has this included, its really quite open.

prudryden

You can request a water meter. The water company will send someone around (takes about 2 months), and probably tell you that they are unable to install a meter. He will give you a signed form. He will take the original and give to the water company. They will then reduce your bill to the average bill for the water company's area.
My bill was reduced by 40% and backdated for the whole year of 2006.

Sybarite

prudryden wrote:

You can request a water meter. The water company will send someone around (takes about 2 months), and probably tell you that they are unable to install a meter. He will give you a signed form. He will take the original and give to the water company. They will then reduce your bill to the average bill for the water company's area.
My bill was reduced by 40% and backdated for the whole year of 2006.

Thanks - that's very useful to know - I'll give the company on Monday. Obviously the LA might of thought of having meters installed - this has been on the card for 18 months, but I guess that's not in their interest.

My short term question is, I suppose, can I refuse to pay the bill as it's unreasonable, pay a proportion, say the average quoted by the water company, or will i have to pay it all?

Alan_M_2

On a similar note, I actually had a water meter installed and it halved my bills as I'm not a heavy user.

Sybarite

silvercar wrote:

if you signed a new tenancy that stated how the water bill would be calculated therre is little you can do. You may consider it an underhand way of having a rent increase but , if you knew that the new contract has this included, its really quite open.

Nope it doesn't state how the water bills are calculated, simply that I'm responsible for paying the utilities.

The LA have been very underhand though - they knew this was a change, slipped it into the contract without telling anyone of any changes when they took over the management, promised I was exempt if I could prove I hadn't previously been responsible, which I did, then changed their mind as soon as evidence was provided. I've received backdated bills with no evidence of actual usage from a water company & interestingly not stating the actual period that they were supposed to cover.

My point I suppose, is do I have to pay a bill that isn't actually in my name & which isn't actually specific to my place of residence?

moonrakerz

I don't think the water companies can actually cut off your water supply for non-payment. That is why if you look at their web sites there are lots of soothing words about how they will "help" you pay off any arrears, but nothing about them actually cutting you off. I think it actually illegal for them to cut you off.

Be interesting if everyone stopped paying !

olly300

You can't refuse to pay the water bill because it would be a breach of your tenancy agreement, however as previously posted you are entitled to install a water meter and pay the water company directly instead of the landlord as you are responsible for all utilities. See this: http://www.defra.gov.uk/environment/water/industry/water_metering/rights.htm

If you do so I would advise you to write to your landlord (keeping a copy) stating why you refuse to pay the joint water bill.

By the way it is very odd and suspicious that the landlord has got a joint water bill for all the separate dwellings. If your dwellings are separate for other bills i.e. council tax then they should be separate for the water bill. I would actually phone up the water company myself and do an enquiry to whether what has been done is legal, you don't have to give your name even if the company pressures you simply state you are finding out information.

Sybarite

olly300 wrote:

You can't refuse to pay the water bill because it would be a breach of your tenancy agreement, however as previously posted you are entitled to install a water meter and pay the water company directly instead of the landlord as you are responsible for all utilities. See this: http://www.defra.gov.uk/environment/water/industry/water_metering/rights.htm

If you do so I would advise you to write to your landlord (keeping a copy) stating why you refuse to pay the joint water bill.

By the way it is very odd and suspicious that the landlord has got a joint water bill for all the separate dwellings. If your dwellings are separate for other bills i.e. council tax then they should be separate for the water bill. I would actually phone up the water company myself and do an enquiry to whether what has been done is legal, you don't have to give your name even if the company pressures you simply state you are finding out information.

Thanks, this is helpful.

I'm aware that they have me over a barrel re the new utility bill, as I've previously stated this was slipped into the contract very quietly. The first bill then turned up out of the blue with a cover letter stating 'if you inspect your contract you'll find' etc.

My suspicion is that the LL hadn't realized that the previous agency hadn't been including water as part of the utilities to be paid by the tenant, instead it was paid as part of the rent. It's his mistake, but obviously he's out to claw back as much as he can from existing tenants, had I know about the intended additional charge, I might,for example, have been less inclined to a % rent increase this year.

I'm prepared to pay a fair rate for the water (ie the rate estimated by the water company for average usage) but not to subsidize my neighbours - hence my issue with the equally split bill. I will check to see if this is actually legal - the point you've made is a good one, the electricity bill is in my name & shows my usage - fair enough. I have a suspicion that what both the LA & LL are doing isn't strictly kosher - this has also been the advise from the previous, dismissed letting agent (although I'm aware they have an axe to grind) - 'not in your name don't pay it'. However I also have a feeling that I know what the response will be to a reasonable letter - if you don't like it give notice - it's what the LA tells me about most issues.

It's not really an odd response from their money-grabbing perspective, the swifter people move through the properties the greater their fees & more money made withholding deposits.

To be frank I'm heartily sick of the way that LAs can (& do) treat people. My case is mild compared to other peoples' once I've started asking around. It's as though you're at war with them over your home & they know they always have the final say as ultimately their sanction is 'here's your two months notice period then' another sucker along in a minute.

While property in London is at the current absurd prices, it seems I, like many other people, am stuck & don't really have a choice but to deal with a LA. Quite frankly if I behaved like this in my professional life I don't think I'd last long, people wouldn't come back - & in their position I'd suffer from an unsound conscience, but this doesn't seem to ever bother them. My present lot have tried it on re the deposit with everyone who has moved out recently - seems to be standard practice to try and fleece people.

moonrakerz

The bottom line is still that no one can cut off your water supply, be that the Water Company, your landlord or even Tony Blair.

Sybarite

Interesting one this, I've contacted the water company, who basically say they can't help (which I expected) & that how the bill is determined is between LL and tenant.

That I can't be billed separately for an individual property as I'm on a shared meter ie they will not issue a bill directly to me based on average usage. Further they will not install meters without the consent of every person in the block & I'm guessing that the people I'm subsidizing aren't going to be keen on this. So it looks as though I'm stuck :mad: