iPhone roaming charges - please help.

macman

No one is winding you up, you just seem to want people to take no responsibility for their own actions. Ultimately it's up to the user to familiarise themselves with their own devices. How much hand-holding do you want the manufacturer or network operator to do?
The issue of high data roaming charges has been documented ad nauseam on this board and in the media generally, which is why people claiming on here that 'I had no idea it would cost me £XXX' get increasingly unsympathetic responses.

Any

macman wrote: »

No one is winding you up, you just seem to want people to take no responsibility for their own actions. Ultimately it's up to the user to familiarise themselves with their own devices. How much hand-holding do you want the manufacturer or network operator to do?
The issue of high data roaming charges has been documented ad nauseam on this board and in the media generally, which is why people claiming on here that 'I had no idea it would cost me £XXX' get increasingly unsympathetic responses.

You want every single person in the world to know exactly how high tech operating system works. That is not going to happen in milion years.
I have asked, where it is said that the phone will be streaming data even if you are not using it - and I got no reply. Apparently I am supposed to know that somehow.

I accept that if you use apps, internet or email on your phone you must realise the data comes from somewhere. There is no question about it in my mind, that is basic required knowledge.

But expecting the typical user to know every in and out of operating system is over the top. In my opinion.

We will just have to agree to disagree.

If everyone knew all that there would be no need for IT tech support in offices or homes. Unfortunately some people lost lots of money over these charges and I feel truly sorry for them.

Guys_Dad

Any wrote: »

You want every single person in the world to know exactly how high tech operating system works.
.

Actually, he doesn't give a stuff whether everybody knows or not. He is ok and so are a lot of us.

What we are saying is that if you want to avoid these huge costs, you need to have a basic understanding of the technology.

This included knowing that they use data in the background. Heaven knows, there is a myriad of information out there and if you know how to use Google, you will find it - if you bother to look. But that's the problem, people don't.

Even an app that tells you how much data you are using through wi-fi or 3G should tip people off to how much their handset is using.

When the battery charge goes down overnight by a significant amount, isn't that some sort of giveaway?

Putting it simply, if you don't learn the basics, it can hurt you in the wallet and the networks won't simply say "we will write it off because you didn't know."

Any

Sorry, battery charge goes down overnight on my Nokia with no 3G technology as well.

Google? Now google, before it was just manual (which is reasonable to be fair), now I also have to check the whole www for every item I get! I better give up work..

Sorry, I don't consider background data download when I am asleep basic. Full stop.

As I said - lets agree to disagree.

grumbler

Guys Dad, your position here surprises me. What I expect from macman, I don't expect from you.

When I buy some appliance I am not supposed to google for any information about it. Fact.

Chargeable background data exchange is not a common knowledge and is not highlighted in the majority of manuals. Fact. The retailers and networks are known not to warn you either. The horror stories in the media are mainly about the idiots/children that deliberately use internet abroad, but know nothing about the prices.

The status quo is that it's user's responsibility to do a research before taking a mobile phone abroad, even if they want to use it as a camera/toy only. This doesn't mean that it has to be this way.

Unfortunately, there are many weird things in our lives that we have to face. This doesn't mean that we have to accept that this is right.

And I know for fact that in some countries there are laws in place already protecting people from enormous charges abroad regardless of the destination. It became the networks' responsibility to warn customers and to suggest them to opt out of the limits if they want. I am pretty sure that this is just a matter of time for us to have the same in UK.

There are many stupid laws around that take ages to get changed. Have you seen the recent TV program about squatters in London? I refused to believe that this was for real and that this was possible in a civilised country.

Guys_Dad

Can I put it simpler, then?

Those people who took the trouble to learn a bit more about smartphones abroad usually don't get hit with big bills. Those who don't, often do.

Personally, I use Google to do research on most things that I am buying, to see what's good, bad and potential benefits/pitfalls. I usually avoid mistakes that way.

As for the Utopia you yearn for (you would have to change your login then though :rotfl::rotfl:),

The status quo is that it's user's responsibility to do a research before taking a mobile phone abroad, even if they want to use it as a camera/toy only. This doesn't mean that it has to be this way.

Unfortunately, there are many weird things in our lives that we have to face. This doesn't mean that we have to accept that this is right.

You are quite right. But in the meantime we have to deal with the here-and-now and manage the risks or face the consequences. So I agree 100% with the first sentence that I quoted above.

So why are you surprised with my previous post??

grumbler

I think nobody here argued about how it is here-and-now. It was clear after the first posts.
The main point of the argument was whether it was right and had to be this way.
In this context your statement "But that's the problem, people don't (bother to look)" sounds odd. The real problem is that people must look (elsewhere, outside of the paperwork).

Any

Guys_Dad wrote: »

Can I put it simpler, then?

Those people who took the trouble to learn a bit more about smartphones abroad usually don't get hit with big bills. Those who don't, often do.

Personally, I use Google to do research on most things that I am buying, to see what's good, bad and potential benefits/pitfalls. I usually avoid mistakes that way.

As for the Utopia you yearn for (you would have to change your login then though :rotfl::rotfl:),

The status quo is that it's user's responsibility to do a research before taking a mobile phone abroad, even if they want to use it as a camera/toy only. This doesn't mean that it has to be this way.

Unfortunately, there are many weird things in our lives that we have to face. This doesn't mean that we have to accept that this is right.

You are quite right. But in the meantime we have to deal with the here-and-now and manage the risks or face the consequences. So I agree 100% with the first sentence that I quoted above.

So why are you surprised with my previous post??

This post reminds me so much the tall guy from Big Bang Theory...

As with everything, it is about what is reasonable to expect an individual to do when they purchase an item.

Of course you can do research, but as a basic consumer you should not need to do "research" on unrelated sites or publications.

If it costs you money or affects your usage you should not need to search for it on unrelated sites, it should be made clear to you.

You could use that argument for anything. Let's say that your internet stores all your passwords and send them to third party who then sells it. Do you think the valid defence would be "but if you googled it, you would have known? There was no need to make user of google bar aware, because the info is out there somewhere?"

dappyhel

Guys_Dad wrote: »

Even an app that tells you how much data you are using through wi-fi or 3G should tip people off to how much their handset is using.

When the battery charge goes down overnight by a significant amount, isn't that some sort of giveaway?

This is one of the things that has really wound me up about this huge bill, especially as the week has gone on and I've had time to think about it.
Okay, I had no idea about the data roaming button being on etc - I did know that every other phone & contract I have had with Orange since I became a customer 10 years ago required me to activate international roaming prior to going abroad, so assumed I'd have to do the same this time, which I didn't. Soon found out I could make a call back to the UK though which told me I did have international roaming activated. But I am a run-of-the-mill, basic phone and laptop user who has a basic knowledge (or perhaps less than basic it now seems).

Anyway, I'm digressing. What has irritated me is that when I rang the billing services to discuss the charges and why my bill was so high, the man straightaway responded with, "yes, we have seen that it's quite a lot higher than usual" - SO WHY THE BL**DY HELL DIDN'T SOMEONE CONTACT ME TO TELL ME?!!! OR CUT ME OFF?! They've did it once before, back in my poorer days - text to tell me I've hit such-and-such amount, cut off until back from holiday a week later. No iPhone then, no internet on my phone.

I'm just baffled by some of the aspects of this bill. Why on earth didn't Orange send a text to tell me the bill was climbing so rapidly? They text and ring me about a variety of other rubbish, "Hello it's so-and-so from Orange, just a quick customer service call". Grrrrr.

Also, the battery was running low on many a day as I use the iPhone for the iPod, hence I put the use of power down to the fact that I was using the iPod for a good few hours each day. See, I am a techno-idiot.

dappyhel

dappyhel wrote: »

Okay, I had no idea about the data roaming button being on etc - I did know that every other phone & contract I have had with Orange since I became a customer 10 years ago required me to activate international roaming prior to going abroad, so assumed I'd have to do the same this time, which I didn't.

I should have made this a bit clearer - every other time I've gone abroad (with previous phones/contracts) I've had to ring Orange in order to activate the roaming. As I didn't ring, I assumed it hadn't activated.