Bankruptcy advice again please

Johnpj

fermi wrote: »

Sorry. I've just been digging in files to see whether a suspended repo order will show up or not, as well as trying to reply on here.

Doesn't appear to from the copy of someones report I have where I know they had one.

However, it will show up one the repo happens if they are going ahead with that.

Again please do not take offence, I am trying to be constructive here. :beer:

When you do it, as in the reply I have quoted above, it "can" come over as the situation is only right when fermi says it is.

It would have been softer and felt more like a community mutual support and help group if you had put something like "I too have just checked and JohnPJ is correct" or something like that. You, and this is meant in a constructive way, have a habbit of appearing to ignore other posters and word it in such a way as its only true when fermi speaks.

I appreciate I am new here, and I have no issue with you checking that which I am post, in fact I would expect you to. But if, after you have checked it appears that I am right, then maybe a slightly more inclusive community wording would be more polite to the new people on here.

ALSO - it is not only yourself, quite a few others on here are not as friendly and welcoming to new people as they could be. We all have to start somewhere, and sometimes you might scare off new people and make them think is it worth it.

Johnpj

fermi wrote: »

Going to have to get on to Experian, as they still have the incorrect info on their website docs in places.

(Although is has vanished quietly from their faq)

One of the main ones, I notice now from the document date, hasn't been update since August 2009. :eek:

I am sure you will agree, the credit reference agencies are a law unto themselves. Yes there are laws and guidelines, but getting them to follow them, and apply them the same way every time, is almost impossible.

It surprises me not in the least that some of their public information is out of date and goes back to 2009.

They are far too self regulating in my personal opinion.

dancingfairy

Hi - how much do your mortgage and dmp payments equal a month?
How much is a comparable rent?
I'm just wondering whether you would qualify for housing benefit or anything when you move?
Would your living expenses go down do you think?

What are the terms on the suspended repo order? I presume that even if you did default you wouldn't be evicted the next day - how long would you get? Would they have to go back to court as this would add extra time?

I'm just trying to think of a way around all this.
df

Johnpj

dancingfairy wrote: »

What are the terms on the suspended repo order? I presume that even if you did default you wouldn't be evicted the next day - how long would you get? Would they have to go back to court as this would add extra time?

I'm just trying to think of a way around all this.
df

When a stay of execution is ordered by the judge it is formally recorded and sent to all parties. If the borrower breaks the terms, then the lender has to re-apply to the court for a warrant of execution ie an eviction.

Technically the stay of executions suspends the enforcement, not the order which would already have been made, at a posession hearing. Where the court decides if the lender is entitled to take posession due to the breach of the terms of the mortgage agreement. Being entitled to take posession does not mean they can, that is the next step, where they are given a warrant of execution.

Once the breach of the court order suspending enforcement is reported back to the court. there then has to be a further hearing, to decide if the eviction should be passed to the bailiffs.

If the borrower can convince the judge, and with "agreement" of the lender, that the arrears can be paid within a reasonable time, then a further stay of execution will be ordered.

I say with "agreement" as the judge has limited scope, even if they felt you deserved a chance, if the lender's solicitor stands up and says NO. Generally, just before the hearing you discuss the situation with the other side, prior to going in to see the judge.

The whole process generally takes around 6 weeks, but can be longer during peak court times.

An example - In the past, and in my experience if you could show, with reasonable certainty that the arrears could be paid off within 1 year, and at the same time the mortgage payments could be paid AS WELL, you would almost always get a stay of execution.

However guidelines change all the time and the 1 year can change, Judges are human do different things, and of course individual lenders have different policies for dealing with court hearings.

For example in the 1990's the then Government "asked" the courts to be leniant, as there was so many evictions from the negative equity trap that it was becoming a major social problem.

Hope that helps

fermi

dancingfairy wrote: »

What are the terms on the suspended repo order? I presume that even if you did default you wouldn't be evicted the next day - how long would you get? Would they have to go back to court as this would add extra time?

I'm just trying to think of a way around all this.
df

http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_advice/repossession/allowed_to_stay#3

If you don't keep to the conditions of a suspended possession order, you can be evicted very easily. For example, if you miss just one payment, your lender can apply for a bailiff's appointment straight away. There isn't normally another hearing and you may only get a few days' warning before the bailiffs arrive to evict you. If you do miss one or more payments and/or you receive a letter from the bailiff, get advice immediately. There may still be time to stop the eviction.

dancingfairy

The first priority would seem to be to sort out the housing issue -as far as I can see.
Your options appear to be:
1) wait until a suitable rental property comes up and then scrabble around trying to raise the money or
2) stop paying the mortgage and dmp and family members for a short time to raise as much cash as possible and hope that something turns up.
3) Depending on the situation with the mortgaged house, wait until the bailiffs turn up and apply for emergency housing from the council. I'm not sure how this would work in terms of you being made/making yourself intentionally homeless rearding making yourself bankrupt or not paying the mortgage. Depending on how this works you will then be able to make a decision between the options.
None of the options seem great so it would seem to be a case of choosing the best option you can and going for it, given that you don't anticipate a dramatic upturn in your finances in the near future.
I'd get advice on how things would stand re the house if you went bankrupt or stopped paying the mortgage and go from there ie if you stopped paying the mortgage to rent privately would the council step in if necessary? if you went bankrupt how long would you have to save up before the OR got you out of the house? etc.
A difficult time for sure. I hope that you are able to get things sorted soon.
Best of Luck
df

dancingfairy

Thanks both. It doesn't seem like it will provide much help then in terms of being able to save emergency funds for renting.
Hmmm.
df

NeverAgain_2

This quote from Shelter (above) is the one I think Maizy needs to be aware of: "You may only get a few days' warning before the bailiffs arrive to evict you."

It accords with the experience of a friend of mine, albeit it was 20+ years ago.

He seemed to go on for months and months with various suspensions and deadlines.

But when the wotsit finally hit the fan, it did so very quickly.

Ineedaname

Johnpj wrote: »

Again please do not take offence, I am trying to be constructive here. :beer:

When you do it, as in the reply I have quoted above, it "can" come over as the situation is only right when fermi says it is.

Fermi is an extremely experienced and valued member of the forum who types only relevant (and correct) information and keeps it short.

Within 24 hours of you joining the forum I walked away for a couple of days because you joined and threw your weight around straight away.

I'm off again for a couple of weeks now so I won't see any response you make to this post.:T

Less is more!

Johnpj

The advice from shelter is a bit dramatic. In practice, and I have considerable experience, both personal and of others, it rarely goes that quickly.

Most importantly when the lender applies to the court for an eviction, the judge will ensure the borrower is/has been made aware. This is on top of the lender having to make the borrower aware that the case is going back to court, normally through more than one letter.

Of course if you ignore the letters then you are putting your home at risk in a big way - a lesson on never ignoring letters.

The judge will "hear" the case from the lender, usually in writing from them, and decide if a warrant of execution is appropriate. I must say that almost all cases will result in the warrant be granted at this stage. When I say "hear", I mean they will normally read the papers on their own in chambers.

When the warrant of execution is passed to the bailiffs they will visit the property, or in many cases send you a copy of the order. On the notice they leave/send will be the date they plan to evict you. It would be rare for that to be just a few days, but technically it is possible. It is more likely to be a reasonable time. The borrower can then immediately apply for a stay of execution hearing.

THe whole process from you actually missing a payment, to the actual evicition day is in practice about 6 weeks. Techncially it could happen the next day, but I have never heard of it. Also many lenders do not request a court eviction with one missed payment, but again technically they could. Some lenders are stricter than others.

Judges like to see people treated fairly, and they appreciate that although a lender is entitled to their property back, keeping people in their home is a high priority. If lenders really turned the screws and went at the speed of light, almost all judges would respond, at the request of a borrower to slow the process down and allow people time to take advice.

The only time when this might not be the case would be if you had already had your eviction suspended 100's of times!!!!! Exagerating I know, but you get my point.

I find Shelter a little too dramatic, as they are a lobby group to government, and get a bit too political at times. As a result they want to give the impression that things are REALLY bad. The CAB are far more level headed and in tune with current court thinking on evictions.

THe most important thing is to NEVER ignore a letter or notice, and NEVER hide it away hoping it will go away.