Terrified at Employment Tribunal

Emmylou_2

SarEl will (I hope) be able to answer this query (of mine) that may help the OP - does the CPR regarding service apply to the ET? If so, hopefully the OP got a Certificate of Service from the post office when she posted off her form (or even has a receipt from paying for it?)

By my (very befuddled brain) calculations, if she posted it first class two days before the deadline, then it doesn't matter when it actually arrived, because service is deemed to have happened two days after posting (ie on the final day of the deadline and therefore in time)

SarEl

Emmylou wrote: »

SarEl will (I hope) be able to answer this query (of mine) that may help the OP - does the CPR regarding service apply to the ET? If so, hopefully the OP got a Certificate of Service from the post office when she posted off her form (or even has a receipt from paying for it?)

By my (very befuddled brain) calculations, if she posted it first class two days before the deadline, then it doesn't matter when it actually arrived, because service is deemed to have happened two days after posting (ie on the final day of the deadline and therefore in time)

Unfortunately the OP has already said - they posted it by ordinary mail and have no receipt or evidence of when it was posted. But evidence of a guaranteed delivery service showing it was posted in time is an allowable reason - it just doesn't apply. Perhaps a lesson for everyone - never stick something important in a post box

Terrified

Hi, thank you all for your comments and advise. I really thank all of you for that.
I have now received a response from my ex-employer's lawyer. They have gone through my notepad and it looks ok to them. That was the only information they asked the judge during the pre-hearing meeting that they wanted to see. I provided that to them immediately without fail.
Now my ex-employer's lawyer have responded back to me that they want more items from me. They want a copy of the document properties log from my computer which is obtained from the ET1 soft copy document. They have asked me to go into "properties" and then from there to click "statistics". They want me to send them a copy of that.
They have also written to the tribunal mentioning that they have asked me for that information and that the next pre-hearing review meeting will only be conducted after I have sent them the above document and that they are satisifed with that document.
I am puzzled here. Does my ex-employer's lawyer have the rights to ask me to send them documents or shouldn't they be going through the tribunal and to let the judge decide on this? Also, during the earlier pre-hearing review, my ex-employer's lawyer only asked for the notepad and the judge agreed to that and that is what I showed them immediately. Now my ex-employer's lawyer are asking for another document. I am sure again they will ask for another and another and this will go on and on.
Do I wait for the tribunal to write to me first to see what the judge has to say or do I have to respond directly to my ex-employer's lawyer?
This is clearly showing me that they want to continue to humiliate me and cause me distress and stressed so that I give up in continuing with my claim. They know that I am about to hit my breaking point.
What should I do?
Thank you.

SarEl

I am very sorry, but whilst I cannot exactly see the point of the evidence that they have asked for since it in no way changes the fact that your claim was late, this is not humiliation - it is exercising their legal right to evidence to support the things that you have claimed (in this case, presumably, when you edited the document in question since you are saying you posted it in time). If a simple request is causing you this much distress then frankly - you had better toughen up because tribunals are no places for shrinking violets. I am sorry to sound harsh, but you need to understand, and understand clearly - this is the start of the process and it is going to get an awful lot tougher. Tribunal judges do not rule on every piece of evidence wanted or requested by either party - they would never have time to do hearings if they did. You have been asked for evidence disclosure and you are expected to comply, just as they will be expected to comply if you ask for something. Of course they are going to ask for disclosures. And you can either comply willingly, or you can wait until the tribunal judge gets fed up of you and orders you to comply - delaying the hearings and damaging your standing in the eyes of the judge. Evidence isn't secret - if your case is sound then evidence supports it and it does not matter when that evidence is disclosed, it will still support what you are saying. Just get it over with and then you can stop stressing about it.

Jarndyce

Oh dear, I have to agree - if you are getting stressed over a simple request for disclosure of a document, you are really not cut out for going through with this, represented or not.

You do realise that you will have to provide evidence to support everything you are saying in your claim, and every sentence is going to be picked up and deconstructed and cross examined by the respondent. All this evidence has to be disclosed and out in the open before the hearing - there are no Perry Mason moments at Employment Tribunals (although I've seen plenty people try and create them!)

Frankly when you said you had 'a few emails' to support your claim alarm bells rang for me. If you do manage to get over the timing issue I strongly urge you to arrange an appointment with an employment lawyer and show them your evidence - if you have no case you are going to go through a hell of a lot of stress for nothing.

KiKi

Terrified wrote: »

They have asked me to go into "properties" and then from there to click "statistics". They want me to send them a copy of that.
They have also written to the tribunal mentioning that they have asked me for that information and that the next pre-hearing review meeting will only be conducted after I have sent them the above document and that they are satisifed with that document.

You submitted the claim late. They want evidence that you did post it on the date you said you did, they have a right to ask for it. You have a similar right to ask them for evidence and see it before the hearing.

I am puzzled here. Does my ex-employer's lawyer have the rights to ask me to send them documents or shouldn't they be going through the tribunal and to let the judge decide on this?

I don't mean to sound unkind, but this isn't 'Legally Blonde'! You don't go in with evidence that no-one else knows about, spring it on them, have a Reese Witherspoon moment and walk out victorious. They and you have a right to see the evidence before the hearing - including you - so that you can prepare your case. What's the point of going in if you have no idea what anyone else is going to say?

This is clearly showing me that they want to continue to humiliate me and cause me distress and stressed so that I give up in continuing with my claim. They know that I am about to hit my breaking point.

It's showing nothing of the sort. It shows that they want evidence of your claim, which they're entitled to ask for.

I understand that you didn't know about not being able to lodge an ET claim before your appeal hearing. But I do not believe that you aren't aware that items get lost or delayed in the post. You sent documents that you knew were time-critical without posting them with Next Day Special Delivery, or Proof of Posting at the very least. The company are trying to find proof of this, and I don't blame them.

Like SarEl and Jarndyce, if you are so sensitive as to think that a simple request for evidence is a conspiracy to break you down, I think you're going to struggle with the ET itself. Best of luck, though.

KiKi

Uncertain

KiKi wrote: »

Like SarEl and Jarndyce, if you are so sensitive as to think that a simple request for evidence is a conspiracy to break you down, I think you're going to struggle with the ET itself. Best of luck, though.

I'm afraid I largely agree with the last three posters except in one respect...

In a way "a conspiracy to break you down" is exactly what this is but sadly it is both normal and legal.

Within reason, from a tactics point of view, you may find it easier to go on the attack rather than feel you are always defending / responding. If nothing else you have the satisfaction of knowing you are running up their bill!

Responding to every request with a separate letter that only half answers the question, ideally also with some point or question they have to refer to their clients can work quite well!

Don't overdo this but with care they may get fed up and look to settle.

SarEl

Uncertain wrote: »

I'm afraid I largely agree with the last three posters except in one respect...

In a way "a conspiracy to break you down" is exactly what this is but sadly it is both normal and legal.

Within reason, from a tactics point of view, you may find it easier to go on the attack rather than feel you are always defending / responding. If nothing else you have the satisfaction of knowing you are running up their bill!

Responding to every request with a separate letter that only half answers the question, ideally also with some point or question they have to refer to their clients can work quite well!

Don't overdo this but with care they may get fed up and look to settle.

I would have to emphasis the "with care" - this is a risky strategy to play because those letters can end up with the judge and make you out to be playing games. Which is certainly not in your interests. And they can equally have the opposite effect - they can !!!! off the employer so much that they decide to take their chances at tribunal.

Terrified

Thank you all for your advise.

I have been thinking through yesterday. With my current office workload and the nervousness I am currently in with the tribunal case where I feel I am just on my own and my ex-employer has a lawyer to represent them, I am thinking of not proceeding with my claim. The reason being, I know my health will be negatively affected and with the continuous back and forth letters and emails from the tribunal and my ex-employer's lawyer and the possibility of having to attend numerous tribunal sessions, this is affecting and will affect my current job and I don't want that to be affected. This is, of course, on top of ensuring my health does not get affected.

If I want to do this, what am I supposed to do? Will my ex-employer's lawyer ask me to pay the cost?

Thanks for your advise.

Jarndyce

I would advise that you let the current issue run its course rather than withdraw now. Whilst the chances of costs being awarded against you are very slim, there is a chance that by withdrawing now they could apply for costs on the basis that you have totally wasted their time.

However if you simply reply to letters on a factual basis and allow the decision on the timing issue to be promulgated in due course then a) if it goes against you the claim falls anyway or b) if it survives then you can reassess then.

But then that's just me, and call me hard-nosed but I'm afraid I can't see why simply respondoing to letters in order to progress a claim which you yourself initiated needs to cause you so much stress.