General discussion for (Tottenham) riots

StevieJ

A._Badger wrote: »

We know the answer to that last part (well, those of us who don't solely rely on the BBC!). At least one Guardian hack has been outed for phone tapping.

http://order-order.com/

I can't imagine why the BBC would be neglecting such a story!

You slipped that one in nicely, even though it is highly unlikely that anyone is doing that at the moment.

FTBFun

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/aug/08/london-riots-tottenham-hotspur

I like Levy's opening line: subtext do you really want us to leave?

StevieJ

FTBFun wrote: »

A pretty pathetic attempt to say the Met are blaming Twitter by the Beeb here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-14439970



Not once has the use of the word "blame" been used there. Think they might be hearing from Twitter's lawyers fairly soon. You might as well blame the mobile phone companies for chavs texting each other!

Actually you may as well blame the BBC for keeping the Chavs abreast of what is going on, after all there was no Twitter in 1981.

On 13 April, Margaret Thatcher dismissed the notion that unemployment and racism lay beneath the Brixton disturbances claiming "Nothing, but nothing, justifies what happened" — although figures showed high unemployment amongst Brixton's black population. Overall unemployment in Brixton stood at 13 percent, with 25.4 percent for ethnic minorities. Unemployment among black youths was estimated at 55 percent. Rejecting increased investment in Britain's inner cities, Thatcher added, "Money cannot buy either trust or racial harmony." Lambeth London Borough Council leader, Ted Knight, complained that the police presence "amounted to an army of occupation" that provoked the riots; Thatcher responded, "What absolute nonsense and what an appalling remark ... No one should condone violence. No one should condone the events ... They were criminal, criminal."
Small scale disturbances continued to simmer throughout the summer. The far-right began its own arson campaign against left wing, ethnic minority and Labour Party bookshops and offices.I][URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed"]citation needed[/URL][/I After four nights of rioting in Liverpool during the Toxteth riots, beginning 4 July, there were 150 buildings burnt and 781 police officers injured. CS gas was deployed for the first time on the British mainland to quell the rioting. On 10 July, there was fresh rioting in Brixton. It was not until the end of July that the disturbances began to subside.[13]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1981_Brixton_riot

lostinrates

ruggedtoast wrote: »

I've had to stop reading the comments on the Guardian as they are just making me angry. Apparently everything is the fault of society and nothing is the fault of the looters who are entitled to steal because they feel angry and hopeless.

How about channelling some of that energy into getting a few NVQs and moving somewhere with better prospects?

there are jobs in London...certainly over the ''generations'' spoken of. They might not always be glamourous, but, for example, there are offices/shops and homes to be cleaned and as often as not the people doing them are not the ''Desperately Seeking work of Wood Green''. London is brilliantly serviced with public transport....and many deprived areas are within walk of employment opportunity. (certainly closer than many of the genuinely hard working foreign workers doing the jobs because our own are too !!!!less.).

Londoners have the least excuse of all to complain about this, because the infrastructure is there, and at higer density than in most other UK places.

Of course, get an NVQ anbd a better job, and I do not deny its hard at the moment for a lot of poeple..but in London least of all do these arguments hold IMO.

Generali

adouglasmhor wrote: »

I have to say me and my mate got jumped in Woolwich by skinheads but it was 30 years ago and they were certainly looking for a fight.

There are certainly plenty of muggings and street violence in London. Not many pub fights tho.

If you insist on going to Arsenal's home you will find trouble!

adouglasmhor

Generali wrote: »

There are certainly plenty of muggings and street violence in London. Not many pub fights tho.

If you insist on going to Arsenal's home you will find trouble!

We were based at the late lamented QEMH (I worked in the royal Arsenal but lived at the hospital) so had little choice, they were leaving a pub closing as we were walking from the tube to our digs after a night out.

movilogo

He explained that he wanted to go back to prison as he had all his meals, recreation, tv and Xbox provided and was frustrated that they kept letting him out before he wanted to go.

No wonder over half of people in UK now want death penalty restored. Although I don't think these not all of these rioters should be hanged, but at least they should be sent to some remote islands with no access to entertainments.

Human right laws should be rewritten so that criminals can be excluded from being called human.

TedButler

Looking on youtube they were actually quing up to loot. Its starting to get light and where are the police?

There are so many people looting that there is not enough room for the next lot to get in through the broken windows.

Looking at the videos coming out now, some looters look like ordinary people stepping out of the borken windows carrying all their stolen goods.

jay213

vivatifosi wrote: »

Another thing that won't win support for the police is that the Guardian is reportedly stating that the bullet in the policeman's radio was police issue and therefore not the result of a gun battle.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/aug/07/police-attack-london-burns

Which not only raises questions about the role of the police, it also brings into question how the Guardian is getting all of its scoops lately.

Im from Tottenham and actually knew the guy Mark that got shot. I wasnt close with him but used to live in the same place. He was an okay guy if you knew him.

His cousin got stabbed to death in a nightclub months earlier, thats why they say he may have had the gun. The gun was alledged to have been found in a sock.

He was travelling in a taxi, 15 minutes before he was killed he texted his gf to say that the feds were following him. Six un-marked police cars cornered the taxi. They put the driver face down, a witness said that both people were face down on the ground when he was shot (the taxi driver & Mark). Another witness claimed that another police officers gun went off, hitting the officer in the chest / police radio. The officer that got hit then shot Mark dead as he thought that the shot must have came from him.

If this is true, than I think the media needs to apologise for the false information about there being a gun fight, Mark shooting at them, etc. These reports were caused in part to the parts of information that the police decided to release. Why did the police feel it was necessary to give out information about there being a non issue firearm found at the scene, if the gun was not fired or brang out during his shooting. They have tried to imply that he shot an officer and that he was shot in retailation.

lostinrates

jay213 wrote: »

He was an okay guy if you knew him.

and if you didn't?

His cousin got stabbed to death in a nightclub months earlier, thats why they say he may have had the gun. The gun was alledged to have been found in a sock.

Presumably you are saying as protection? Tragic to lose a brother...what were the circumstances?

15 minutes before he was killed he texted his gf to say that the feds were following him. Six un-marked police cars cornered the taxi.

Why were the police following him or interested in him...do we know?

Why did the police feel it was necessary to give out information about there being a non issue firearm found at the scene, if the gun was not fired or brang out during his shooting. QUOTE]

Perhaps it makes it clear this person was not law abiding and was capable of doing damage even if it were not ''brang out''?