not great tenants.. who's responsible?

sunster

I'm just after opinions and advice here. I understand that I'm probably in the minority here as I'm a landlord wanting advice rather than a tenant.

I've had a student renting out a property of mine. There was a break in where she lost a fair amount of her property (jewellery, laptop) along with a television of mine. The TV is about 5 years old and was £700 new.

The cost of the door repair came to £135. I don't have contents insurance and am prepared to take the loss of an old TV on the chin.

Here's the catch however. There are two locks on the door - a latch lock (a yale) and a 5 lever mortice lock. She went away for a holiday for a fortnight without locking the door using the mortice. This was despite being told at the beginning of her agreement and twice during to make sure she did so.

Her reply was that she didn't see it necessary to lock it as there was a communal door downstairs (to a block of 6 flats) and the the key provided to her didn't work. (Later on I asked for the key back to find that it looked as if she'd bent it - at no point had she requested a new key... over a year into her tenancy and the keys provided to her were all tested naturally)

I spoke to the police officers who had handled the break in and their advice was that it was negligence on her part and they didn't see why I should be paying for the door damage. Also, to be fair when asked about the cost of the TV they did feel that a stolen item could not be placed under that bracket of negligence - she didn't of course break in herself!

The end of this story is that this tenant is moving out in a couple of months. I spoke to her today and she put me onto her Dad who is a guarantor of the lease agreement. I basically got abuse down the line from him, accusing me of being a bad landlord amongst the swear
words.

After speaking to my wife, and calming down, I made the decision to meet her half way and ask for half the repair fee.

She phoned back and initially talked about not wanting to end things like this and that we should come to a professional agreement. However, when I asked her what she meant about that she felt that she shouldn't be paying the cost at all and that was that. She then said she would think about paying half the cost IF I could guarantee that she would get all her deposit back - I can't actually do this as part of the lease agreement is the inclusion of an independent inventory (which helps both parties in the event of a dispute). Finally, she said that she'd taken advice and that in terms of the property she was not happy with it, inferring that I somehow had not leased it out as advertised. None of this is true at all, which is why I got a proper solicitors agreement and an inventory drawn up in the first place.

So, I'm pretty shaken by all this. I didn't break in... neither did she, but who leaves for a fortnight and doesn't lock the door properly?

Am I right in asking for the door repairs? I should mention that of course my buildings insurance stipulates that there is a 5 lever mortice on the entry door - I would assume that the onus is that it it is USED to keep the door secure when leaving the house. All of this is by the by as my excess is £500 anyway.

Advice and opinions would be greatly appreciated.

DVardysShadow

sunster wrote: »

I spoke to the police officers who had handled the break in and their advice was that it was negligence on her part and they didn't see why I should be paying for the door damage. Also, to be fair when asked about the cost of the TV they did feel that a stolen item could not be placed under that bracket of negligence - she didn't of course break in herself!

Disregard the advice from the police. They are not qualified to give opinions on the law. It is actually far wiser to come and ask a load of strangers on the internet. Seriously.

As to the facts, your buildings insurance is invalidated by failure to use the mortice lock. If the key did not work, the tenant should have reported that to you, and then if you let it go into the long grass, it would be down to you. But she didn't. So plainly, she should bear the cost of repairs.

As for the TV, at 5 years old, it is certainly worth no more than 20% of its original value - probably 15% is fairer - say £100. You cannot expect new for old replacement. Take it from her deposit.

BitterAndTwisted

She's a stupid numpty and her father is a very rude one. Do as DVardy has advised and deduct the whole of the door repair and 20% of the original cost of the telly. That'll teach her not to lock up properly. I can't believe that she's not taking all of this more seriously. I guess that's what comes of having a Daddy to hand the phone over to you when you can't wipe your own @rse

sunster

Thanks for the advice so far guys, means a lot. I do feel that I'm in the right here. Of course no one can anticipate a break in (and her view is just that... that she didn't do the breaking in, so not her fault), but it feel like negligence to me. However, speaking to a friend of mine who lets out lots of properties, his take is that a locked door is a locked door no matter if it's on a latch lock or a deadlock?!?

May be getting legal advice on this one - something I can't really afford to do either

BitterAndTwisted

A mortice lock is much more effective at preventing a break-in than a Yale. Which is presumably why you had it installed and she should have used it. Don't bother with paying for legal advice, just go through the deposit scheme and claim your deduction. I doubt the arbitrators will find against you given the circs.

G_M

Check you insurance policy - In 95% of them there will be stipulations about the kind of locks you must have. Yale: no. 5 lever mortice - yes.
And there will be conditions about USING the appropriate lock.

So your friend is wrong. A locked door is NOT a locked door.

You case would be stronger if your tenant had it in WRITING (either in the tenancy agreement or separately) that both locks should be used, but even without this, the tenant has a duty of care, and a duty to act in a 'tenant-like manner'. Leaving a door half-locked (not even that as a yale is insufficient) is not 'tenantlike'.

Deduct from deposit. She'll go to arbitration. You'll present your arguements. And almost certainly win.

sunster

Probably a silly question, but if it came to arbitration, would I need to exercise a claim to prove that I could not claim? Also, if it came to arbitration would this be a costly thing to do, or is it one of those where the losing party has to foot the costs?

I should mention that I live in Scotland just in case there is a different set up here.

BitterAndTwisted

You make the deduction from her deposit for the costs you have mentioned and she'll have to take you to court to reclaim it. If you lose you'll have to pay her costs, which should not be that substantial. I honestly can't see how you could lose but I'm not a lawyer: your proposed deductions seem perfectly reasonable to me. She was negligent and should have to compensate you for your loss.

Yorkie1

sunster wrote: »

Probably a silly question, but if it came to arbitration, would I need to exercise a claim to prove that I could not claim? Also, if it came to arbitration would this be a costly thing to do, or is it one of those where the losing party has to foot the costs?

I should mention that I live in Scotland just in case there is a different set up here.

Is the property also in Scotland? If so, I don't think any of the comments referring to arbitration will apply as you don't have a tenancy deposit scheme up there.

clutton_2

make sure you have documented all these conversatioins, write letters to them both, recording what was said on the phone so that you have evidence farther down the line.

Take dated photos of the locks in question

Make a deduction from the deposit. Let them take you to court. They probably wont.

moomaa

I don't know what is legally right but I think your suggestion of going halves on the door was fair and reasonable. If they don't want to pay it maybe you should bill for the TV too.......

We were broken into as students, a housemate didn't use the bottom lock. Our landlord's reaction was to check we were ok, send handymen round immediately to fix all the damage, install an alarm and security lighting. We were not charged for anything. I am incredibly grateful to that landlord. I am not suggesting this should be usual or expected but I think this showed a great deal of compassion.