Are the CSA rates fair?

jetta_wales

izzybusy23 wrote: »

I told you in a recent post that I thought you were being too kind on your ex but you scoffed me! Personally if he cannot manage on 80% of what seems to be a fair income (or 85%, sorry don't know if you get 15 or 20%) then that is his look out, not yours. You should want the best for your children; why should you scrimp because your ex has debts? They are his problem not your yours.

No, I don't think the CSA payments are fair. But then thats probably because I am only getting 10% at the moment as there are two PWC's and soon to be 8% because my ex can't keep his d.ick in his trousers and stop producing kids he doesn't want.

I'm crap at remembering who posts what to be honest but maintaining a good relationship with him too has to be taken into consideration to degree. I've always agree'd I have been too soft on him but I think it is right to stick to giving him the period to adjust to the increased amount.

But absolutely his debts are his doing and I have been soft for long enough now so I did decide to let him know I do intend for it to go upto the full amount. It's 20% - 2/7ths as he has them two nights so that's only about 14.2% of his income, he'll still have the other 85.8% to waste however he choses lol.

My Mum says if I don't take it to spend on them then he certainly won't spend it on them. He did say he didn't think the amount should be higher just because he earns more but if you earn more money you provide more for your kids don't you? Be it a bigger house a new hobby or club they can join, whatever. I told Mum he said that and she said he was a Berk lol. Gotta love Mums

DUTR

jetta_wales wrote: »

I'm crap at remembering who posts what to be honest but maintaining a good relationship with him too has to be taken into consideration to degree. I've always agree'd I have been too soft on him but I think it is right to stick to giving him the period to adjust to the increased amount.

But absolutely his debts are his doing and I have been soft for long enough now so I did decide to let him know I do intend for it to go upto the full amount. It's 20% - 2/7ths as he has them two nights so that's only about 14.2% of his income, he'll still have the other 85.8% to waste however he choses lol.

My Mum says if I don't take it to spend on them then he certainly won't spend it on them. He did say he didn't think the amount should be higher just because he earns more but if you earn more money you provide more for your kids don't you? Be it a bigger house a new hobby or club they can join, whatever. I told Mum he said that and she said he was a Berk lol. Gotta love Mums

Not necessarily, the line has to be drawn somewhere, parents have needs and wants too you know.
The NRP would not have 85% to do as they please as they have living costs too.
I'm semi dissapointed though with the amount of posts that seem to suggest slightly that if you can obtain as much as or sling as much money as possible towards a child that it in someway makes a better parent
Ask for the full amount due, after that there need not be any further discussion on the matter of CS contributions :cool:

jetta_wales

DUTR wrote: »

Not necessarily, the line has to be drawn somewhere, parents have needs and wants too you know.
The NRP would not have 85% to do as they please as they have living costs too.
I'm semi dissapointed though with the amount of posts that seem to suggest slightly that if you can obtain as much as or sling as much money as possible towards a child that it in someway makes a better parent
Ask for the full amount due, after that there need not be any further discussion on the matter of CS contributions :cool:

Of course there has to be a limit and I think it should much lower than it currently is but £32k is not an excessive wage by any means, a good one but not to the point that you'd be spoiling kids if you provided more for them.

It is not about throwing money at them either but making sacrifices yourself for the sake of them and their futures. I make plenty of sacrifices but he just wastes and only sacrifices if he's in a real mess and getting hounded over it. He wouldn't swap to packed lunches so he could buy them good new school shoes let's say, but he would skip lunches all together (making sandwiches would sound too much like effort lol) if he was getting calls demanding payments.

AnxiousMum

DUTR wrote: »

Not necessarily, the line has to be drawn somewhere, parents have needs and wants too you know.
The NRP would not have 85% to do as they please as they have living costs too.
I'm semi dissapointed though with the amount of posts that seem to suggest slightly that if you can obtain as much as or sling as much money as possible towards a child that it in someway makes a better parent
Ask for the full amount due, after that there need not be any further discussion on the matter of CS contributions :cool:

Are we reading the same thread DUTR? I don't see any posts that claim the more money you throw at a kid the better parent you are....I do mention a couple of school trips - which are compulsory, and a non compulsory and expensive one - which my son is doing odd jobs to contribute to it himself, as well as a bit of help from mum and dad. He has three years to save towards it.....

DUTR

jetta_wales wrote: »

Of course there has to be a limit and I think it should much lower than it currently is but £32k is not an excessive wage by any means, a good one but not to the point that you'd be spoiling kids if you provided more for them.

It is not about throwing money at them either but making sacrifices yourself for the sake of them and their futures. I make plenty of sacrifices but he just wastes and only sacrifices if he's in a real mess and getting hounded over it. He wouldn't swap to packed lunches so he could buy them good new school shoes let's say, but he would skip lunches all together (making sandwiches would sound too much like effort lol) if he was getting calls demanding payments.

When I said limit I didn't mean the csa limit, if there was a text book couple and they earned x amount if the for whatever reason the income becoame 1.3 x the extra .3 would not necessarily be split between the family on a pro rata basis.
If for instance your child's father won a million on the lotto the cost of raising the child does not suddenly increase, but likewise if he was made redundant the child costs do not suddenly reduce.
There was a guy on a gameshow over the weekend, he won himself some money and he already knew he was going to treat himself and nobody else with the money, had he won more I'm sure the extra above his treat he would then treat the rest of his family, his sacrifices had and currently were ongoing, so that was his line.
Hope that makes sense

DUTR

AnxiousMum wrote: »

Are we reading the same thread DUTR? I don't see any posts that claim the more money you throw at a kid the better parent you are....I do mention a couple of school trips - which are compulsory, and a non compulsory and expensive one - which my son is doing odd jobs to contribute to it himself, as well as a bit of help from mum and dad. He has three years to save towards it.....

Thread or threads? I was not specifying this thread, just generally on these type of boards, and was not aimed at anyone in particular.

izzybusy23

jetta_wales wrote: »

I'm crap at remembering who posts what to be honest but maintaining a good relationship with him too has to be taken into consideration to degree. I've always agree'd I have been too soft on him but I think it is right to stick to giving him the period to adjust to the increased amount.

But absolutely his debts are his doing and I have been soft for long enough now so I did decide to let him know I do intend for it to go upto the full amount. It's 20% - 2/7ths as he has them two nights so that's only about 14.2% of his income, he'll still have the other 85.8% to waste however he choses lol.

My Mum says if I don't take it to spend on them then he certainly won't spend it on them. He did say he didn't think the amount should be higher just because he earns more but if you earn more money you provide more for your kids don't you? Be it a bigger house a new hobby or club they can join, whatever. I told Mum he said that and she said he was a Berk lol. Gotta love Mums

Does your ex know how much he should be paying and how leniant you have been? Definately take the extra money; even if you don't need it now, put it in savings. Like I said in a previous post; children grow up, cost more, demand more etc and it may well be all good accepting what he gives you now for the benefit of maintaining a good relationship; but that could change in the future if a new baby, new wife came into the equation etc. That amicable relationship can suddenly sour and turn nasty, trust me, been there! My berk of an ex has said that when baby number 3 by woman number 3 comes along, he won't reduce my maintenance money because he wants to be a good dad to our DD.. we'll see. He's full of it. When the going's good, its good and friendly, but I know to take it with a pinch of salt with my ex because I swear he gets PMT!

jetta_wales

izzybusy23 wrote: »

Does your ex know how much he should be paying and how leniant you have been? Definately take the extra money; even if you don't need it now, put it in savings. Like I said in a previous post; children grow up, cost more, demand more etc and it may well be all good accepting what he gives you now for the benefit of maintaining a good relationship; but that could change in the future if a new baby, new wife came into the equation etc. That amicable relationship can suddenly sour and turn nasty, trust me, been there! My berk of an ex has said that when baby number 3 by woman number 3 comes along, he won't reduce my maintenance money because he wants to be a good dad to our DD.. we'll see. He's full of it. When the going's good, its good and friendly, but I know to take it with a pinch of salt with my ex because I swear he gets PMT!

I don't think he realised before quite how little he actually was paying but he knows now I'd love to have seen his face when he first ran the CSA calculation on-line himself lol.

I am going to stick with the staggered increase till it reaches the CSA figure (it'll only take till Christmas) and I think the reason he hasn't complained to much must be partly because he doesn't want to risk me reneging on that. But from then on the leeway will be done with for good.

As for him getting a new partner or further kids lol he's a hermit and hasn't had anybody in his life since me (I have no doubt of that at all). So I think I'm safe there for now. He had dinner with us at my folks recently for our you vests birthday and we all went out for a meal a month later for our eldests birthday with my folks again too and I know he doesn't want to jeopardise that relationship either. He's coming to the school with me on Monday to discuss their split classes for next year and we've already confirmed Christmas eve at our house again as usual too. It's been 4 years now so unless by some odd miracle he gets laid, I don't think we have to worry He's told me he's really not interested in another relationship as he enjoys his [strike]computer games[/strike] freedom too much :rotfl:

izzybusy23

jetta_wales wrote: »

I don't think he realised before quite how little he actually was paying but he knows now I'd love to have seen his face when he first ran the CSA calculation on-line himself lol.

I am going to stick with the staggered increase till it reaches the CSA figure (it'll only take till Christmas) and I think the reason he hasn't complained to much must be partly because he doesn't want to risk me reneging on that. But from then on the leeway will be done with for good.

As for him getting a new partner or further kids lol he's a hermit and hasn't had anybody in his life since me (I have no doubt of that at all). So I think I'm safe there for now. He had dinner with us at my folks recently for our you vests birthday and we all went out for a meal a month later for our eldests birthday with my folks again too and I know he doesn't want to jeopardise that relationship either. He's coming to the school with me on Monday to discuss their split classes for next year and we've already confirmed Christmas eve at our house again as usual too. It's been 4 years now so unless by some odd miracle he gets laid, I don't think we have to worry He's told me he's really not interested in another relationship as he enjoys his [strike]computer games[/strike] freedom too much :rotfl:

I can see why you don't want to risk the good balance you two seem to have. My relationship with my ex swings from good to bad and back again; all dependent on whats going on in his life. He bought my DD 2 rabbits and a mahoosive hutch the other sunday and I was stuck in the kitchen with him for THREE hours helping him build this hutch (as it was p.issing down) only for the damn thing to warp so this Sunday he is back again to build a new hutch and dismantle the other to take back.. its all amiable at the moment, he's even paid my maintenance direct this month and paid off his arrears to me (:eek:) but it can so easily swing back to nastiness with him, especially if he thinks there is a chance I may be dating .

I think what you are doing is great; staggering it is good and benefits both of you.

GobbledyGook

lazer wrote: »

Personally I don;t think its fair either,

If 2 parents have basically 50:50 access, why should one pay the other.
Say mother has kids 4 nights, father has kids 3 nights or vice versa, why shoud the the father pay the mother the CSA amount less 3/7ths.
Do they not both have the same costs in terms of raising the children, both need a house to keep them in, have the associated costs of this etc
The only costs possibly not shared are the clothing costs, which could quite easily be spilt 50:50 also.

In my case (though we're not quite 50:50) the income he has is massively more than what I have. If he didn't pay CSA then at his house my children would be horse riding, attending expensive events and wearing designer clothes whereas at mine they'd be going nowhere and I'd struggle with day-to-day expenses on my wage.

We made the decision to have our children and give them a certain lifestyle. His decision to cheat means that my life has changed dramatically and I accept that. However it shouldn't mean that the children miss out on everything when he can still afford it imo. He promised the children we were having a certain lifestyle and whilst he can afford it they should have it.

Even if we had 50:50 care we'd never have 50:50 wages because I walked away from university to allow him to move to further his career. We made that choice together and that, unfortunately for him some will say, ties him to financially providing for the children through me until they are are 18. Children shouldn't be forced to give up their lifestyle because one parent has walked away (in our case).