Fault with my 16-month old £400 HP laptop - do I have any rights?

CoolHotCold

http://whatconsumer.co.uk/how-long-should-it-last/

Ok I take your second point about the Durability claim, but I'm still dubious

[F12(2)
Where the seller sells goods in the course of a business, there is an implied term that the goods supplied under the contract are of satisfactory quality.

(2A)
For the purposes of this Act, goods are of satisfactory quality if they meet the standard that a reasonable person would regard as satisfactory, taking account of any description of the goods, the price (if relevant) and all the other relevant circumstances.

(2B)
For the purposes of this Act, the quality of goods includes their state and condition and the following (among others) are in appropriate cases aspects of the quality of goods—

(a)fitness for all the purposes for which goods of the kind in question are commonly supplied,

(b)appearance and finish,

(c)freedom from minor defects,

(d) safety, and

(e) durability.

See I would take that as Durability a component of satisfactory quality statement, which i believe would require a opinion require a expert opinion on that the fault was there outside of 6 months.

Hammyman

MarkBargain wrote: »

I read on the internet (http://smidgenpc.com/2010/05/07/laptop-reliability-ratings-which-laptop-is-really-most-reliable/) that about a quarter of HP machines develop faults in the first three years, and my sister's laptop is 10 months old and has been returned with two faults already (fan and screen). Shouldn't HP be required to sell more robust machines that last more in line with what one would expect from a £400 purchase?

THIS IS REALLY SIMPLE FOLKS, YOU ARE GETTING WHAT YOU PAY FOR.

I sell used business laptops. Some, such as the Dell Latitude D610s are 5 years old and look nearly new, still on the original battery which is giving 2-3hrs or more. I sell them because I never have any comebacks because they're built like tanks and, in the case of the Thinkpads I'm currently selling which have keyboard drain holes for example, they have design features to protect them from users.

What is the difference between these and the £400 HPs that barely survive the guarantee? The ones I sell were typically £1200-£1500+ new.

You can have good robust laptops - I sell plenty. However you cannot have good robust laptops and low prices. When you look at the price for the robust business laptops which last for at least half a decade without issues and then look at the price you're paying for consumer grade laptops it is clearly obvious that as you're paying only 20-25% of the business range but getting more RAM and larger hard drives that you're getting cheap build quality.

When you pay £400 for a laptop with 3-4GB of RAM and a 320-500GB HDD, you are getting what you pay for. Unfortunately for most, its not quite the "getting what you pay for" that people think because in their minds £400 is a lot of money but for laptops, it really is Lada prices.

People say Macbook Pros are underspecced and overpriced. But the thing people miss is the Macbook Pros have the build quality of the corporate windows ones which are equally underspecced to the consumer level ones - 2GB RAM and 160GB HDDs are still common in the £1000+ corporate range. When you compare them with the corporate laptop sector, Macbook Pros are actually quite cheap.

MarkBargain

Thanks for the latest postings.

I take the point about getting what you pay for, although I still think a £400 machine should last more than 16 months. Yes, I could have spent £1,200 on a business class Dell, but this laptop is just just for light use and is never even taken out of the house. I suspect 99% of home laptop users buy machines aimed at the home market, and I think consumers should expect laptops that last around three years for their money. Indeed one could buy a three year warranty for £59 extra, which is probably a sensible thing to do with a view that anything over three years is a bonus.

By the way, at work we bought £1,000+ HP laptops and they lasted about three to five years before breaking down and needing replacement, which wasn't bad but then that did work out about £250 a year which is itself the cost of a cheap consumer laptop with a year's guarantee anyway these days.

asbokid

MarkBargain wrote: »

I take the point about getting what you pay for, although I still think a £400 machine should last more than 16 months. Yes, I could have spent £1,200 on a business class Dell, but this laptop is just just for light use and is never even taken out of the house. I suspect 99% of home laptop users buy machines aimed at the home market, and I think consumers should expect laptops that last around three years for their money. Indeed one could buy a three year warranty for £59 extra, which is probably a sensible thing to do with a view that anything over three years is a bonus. By the way, at work we bought £1,000+ HP laptops and they lasted about three to five years before breaking down and needing replacement, which wasn't bad but then that did work out about £250 a year which is itself the cost of a cheap consumer laptop with a year's guarantee anyway these days.

http://www.squaretrade.com/htm/pdf/SquareTrade_laptop_reliability_1109.pdf

Hammyman

From the link...

Synopsis: SquareTrade analyzed failure rates for over 30,000 new laptop computers covered by
SquareTrade Laptop Warranty plans and found that one-third of all laptops will fail within 3 years.

Please note that the above graphs state premium. Premium can mean the Sony Vaio type. I doubt very much that it means the corporate range I was reffering to as every corporate one I've ever sold has been covered by 3 years next day onsite parts and labour warranties BY THE MANUFACTURER so the chances of Squaretrade having any actual figures at all for corporate ones are NIL because why would you take out a warranty with Squaretrade when you can phone up Lenovo at 3pm and have an engineer on the doorstep at 9am the following morning? (And yes, that is from personal experience).

MarkBargain

If the graph is right, 79.4% of entry level laptops do not have malfunctions in the first three years, which isn't bad. I have no doubt that corporate laptops last longer, but I don't think the extra expense if worth it for the average home user and there is more to lose if a £1,000+ laptop packs up rather than a more replaceable £400 machine.

Hammyman

MarkBargain wrote: »

If the graph is right, 79.4% of entry level laptops do not have malfunctions in the first three years, which isn't bad. I have no doubt that corporate laptops last longer, but I don't think the extra expense if worth it for the average home user and there is more to lose if a £1,000+ laptop packs up rather than a more replaceable £400 machine.

Thats 79% of machines covered by their insurance. How many people would buy Squartrades insurance?

And if your £400 laptop packs up every 12-14 months and you get over 3 years out of the £1000 one, the £1000 one has saved you £200+

However if you've not got £1k to blow on a laptop, the whole argument becomes irrelevant.

MarkBargain

Hammyman wrote: »

Thats 79% of machines covered by their insurance. How many people would buy Squartrades insurance?

And if your £400 laptop packs up every 12-14 months and you get over 3 years out of the £1000 one, the £1000 one has saved you £200+

However if you've not got £1k to blow on a laptop, the whole argument becomes irrelevant.

Laptops are all covered by warranty for 12-months, so if one were to break down between months 12 to 14 that is very unlucky, and for it to happen three times the owner must be under some sort of curse. Plus of course a fault doesn't mean a total write off, as the laptop could be repaired for a cost, or sold as spares or repair on Ebay.

I totally understand why businesses buy business class machines however, as faults cost a lot of money in staff time and hassle, and work for the IT department. It's much easier to buy more reliable builds and then get them under a 3-year warranty.

Hammyman

MarkBargain wrote: »

Laptops are all covered by warranty for 12-months, so if one were to break down between months 12 to 14 that is very unlucky,

Remember when Tesco were selling those low rent Toshiba L300's about 18 months ago for just over £200? I saw a lot of them - mostly charge sockets and hinges and the rest overheating problems. As for the low rent version of the Samsung R519, they're forever having keys fall off the keyboards. I sell loads of keys - out of all the keyboard keys I sell, the Samsung R519 is the most popular.

asbokid

Hammyman wrote: »

Thats 79% of machines covered by their insurance. How many people would buy Squartrades insurance?

It probably pans out at the other end of the spectrum..

I bet most buyers of really cheap-and-nasty laptops are on such a tight budget that they couldn't spare the cash to buy insurance even if they wanted it.

That subprime group of laptop owner doesn't even make it onto the Squaretrade graphs.