Badly let down by Paypal protection

d.ross_2

Out of interest what was it you were buying, and was it brand new?

KiKi

JimBeau wrote: »

We told them over and over what had happened but they got stuck in the rut of tracking the return. Thanks for all comments so far, poster hermum, when you said that a refused delivery is enough to for the seller to win the case, did you mean seller or buyer?

They meant buyer. If you refuse delivery, then the seller can't prove it's been delivered, so the buyer would usually win.

If you identify an item as 'not as described', then Ebay assume you *did* receive it and have returned it. But if you can't prove you've returned it, then the seller would usually win. Which is what's happened in your case because you opened the wrong dispute (as far as winning is concerned) - you are highly unlikely to win unless you can get someone sensible to listen to you.


I appreciate that you're saying Paypal / Ebay are stuck in the idea that you didn't track the return, but you only track a return once the item's been delivered and you've decided you don't want it. You need to go back - again - and explain to Paypal / Ebay that you NEVER ACCEPTED DELIVERY. Ie, you *meant* to open an 'item not received' dispute, not an 'item not as described' dispute. That's the really, really important thing!

KiKi

JimBeau_2

Sorry, we don't have anything from the delivery man or even any idea which company it was. The item was a cast iron woodburning stove and it arrived on a pallet on a high lorry with no tail lift. Luckily (or maybe not) I was home to help the man unload but as it was obviously too heavy he suggested we should unwrap it and see if it came into smaller parts. The packaging wasn't damaged but was flimsy and when undressed we saw that the top had a crack in the casting and the door glass was smashed and the internal gubbins had all been dislodged, it had obviously fallen on its face at some stage. We have had previous experience of iron things arriving broken and us not spotting it till after we had signed for them as being in good condition and were not going to get caught again. With hindsight, at least we would have had a stove, even a broken one.

hermum

theonlywayisup wrote: »

Unfortunately, as you opened the wrong case, You must prove tracking of return to generate a refund,

If you can convince them you made an error and to change the case to Item Not Received, you will win.

Doesn't the seller have to just prove attempted delivery to win an INR case?

JimBeau_2

The item was new and the seller sold a lot of kitchen/Aga things, stove pipes and stoves.

hermum

If you didn't sign anything then I would have done an INR. Although from what others have said that's what you should have done, I apologise for being stupid.
I would definitely be calling ebay & appealing their decision.
(I can't believe that you didn't ask for proof that you refused delivery & don't know who delivered the stove, I'm sure that you've said that yourself)

JimBeau_2

Sorry, hermum, for being so lax! Next time we will photo the broken item etc etc, but at the time we were just heavily disappointed that instead of sitting by a hot stove we would be involved in a dispute.

KiKi

JimBeau wrote: »

Sorry, hermum, for being so lax! Next time we will photo the broken item etc etc, but at the time we were just heavily disappointed that instead of sitting by a hot stove we would be involved in a dispute.

The fact that you didn't accept it isn't the issue - it's the fact that you recorded it incorrectly (as far as Ebay are concerned) in order to win the case...see my post above. Re-contacting Paypal / Ebay and finding someone sensible to speak to is the first port of call.

KiKi

hermum

JimBeau wrote: »

Sorry, hermum, for being so lax! Next time we will photo the broken item etc etc, but at the time we were just heavily disappointed that instead of sitting by a hot stove we would be involved in a dispute.

I'm not having a go but you have no proof now that you didn't receive a nice cast iron stove.
You don't need photos just proof that it was broken & refused.
Did you sign anything? This could come down to he said, she said else.

JimBeau_2

We signed nothing.