Incapacity Benefit migration to ESA

dmg24

iluvmarmite wrote: »

Still very confused about the whole ESA thing. I know someone who has been on IB for 7 or more years, has been told she does not need any more sick notes from the doctor, and does not need to ever have one of those PCA things and claims high rate DLA in both care and mobility componants, how does it work for her as most say they will be assessed for ESA when their next PCA is due, will they just write to her out of the blue and say she now needs to attend a medical? i just dont get it.

Yep, that is correct. The only exception is if she is near retirement age. She may not get called for a medical, she may be assessed on the basis of medical reports, but most will have a medical.

iluvmarmite

Ok thanks dmg I guess its just a waiting game now

chloebug

MONEYPENNY wrote: »

Would you like to explain the difference to us less enlightened folk the difference between sickness and disability benefits, and what does the ESA cover exactly, maybe you could give examples!.

As a disabled person in a wheelchair from birth I receive HRM and HRC as I have needs specific to disability. However I am not in receipt of ESA as I am not 'sick' and work full time. As pointed out many disabled people do work and can be in receipt of disability whereas some people might be ill and not able to work and therefore receive sickness benefits such as ESA.

sunnyone

iluvmarmite wrote: »

Still very confused about the whole ESA thing. I know someone who has been on IB for 7 or more years, has been told she does not need any more sick notes from the doctor, and does not need to ever have one of those PCA things and claims high rate DLA in both care and mobility componants, how does it work for her as most say they will be assessed for ESA when their next PCA is due, will they just write to her out of the blue and say she now needs to attend a medical? i just dont get it.

Ive been on IVB for 20 years and I havnt had medicals or anything since the hospital staff did a form while I was in rehab after my accident, I was on MRC/HRM until a few years ago when I was uprated to HRC/HRM, so I dont have a due date for a PCA and Im just waiting for the brown envalope to land on the mat (and someone to pick it up lol)

It will happen when it happens and Im not to worried because Im so severely disabled, fulltime powerchair user because I cant use a manual wheelchair and my arms/hands dont work very well and Im severely/profoundly deaf.

MONEYPENNY

I shall try once more , sunnyone said the article was misleading, I have read through the article 4 times and is entitled " The War Against The Disabled" and it is not, repeat not misleading

The war against the disabled


A DAMNING report has condemned the new system of disabled benefits assessments for throwing the most vulnerable people in the country into a state of “financial worry and stress”.
The scathing report from Citizens Advice Scotland (CAS), which has now been lodged with the Work and Pensions Committee of the House of Commons, says some disabled people are having to wait up to nine months to appeal decisions to strip them of cash.
Disabled rights organisation, charities, pressure groups and politicians have also rallied together to condemn the “chaos” that the new system of is causing.
Figures have also come to light showing 120 people each day successfully appeal against rulings that they are fit to work.
The Government has hired French company Atos to assess if disabled people claiming incapacity benefit and employment support allowance are entitled to payments or fit for work.
Assessments are finding roughly 40% of claimants fit for work. Some 1.9 million disabled people are due to be assessed in the next three years. From this week onwards the system will accelerate to assess a total of 11,000 people a week.
The CAS report shows the system of welfare reform is leading to a huge bottleneck of appeals and a delay in cases reaching tribunal of around six to nine months. CAS says this is “causing considerable financial worry and stress to claimants”.
Dr Eilidh Whiteford, SNP Work and Pensions spokesperson, said: “The system as it currently stands is obviously flawed and must be reviewed immediately to ensure that those genuinely unable to work are not faced with the stress and financial instability of unnecessary assessment.”
Whiteford, MP for Banff and Buchan in Aberdeenshire, the area in which the current system to tackle incapacity benefit was piloted, also added: “I know from cases in my own constituency of people being wrongly assessed, and whose conditions are actually being exacerbated by the process. While welfare reform is of course necessary, we should not forget that we are dealing with the lives of some of the most vulnerable people in our society.”
CAS says around 70% of its time is spent dealing with employment support allowance claims and appeals. Sunday Herald research has found many people are locked in a seemingly endless cycle of assessment and appeal, in which they are found fit to work, appeal the decision successfully, but then are quickly assessed again by ATOS as fit again. Meanwhile, the actual financial cost of the tribunals, which for the period between October 2008 and June 2009 was £11 million, is estimated to be now something closer to £50m.

The CAS report also points out that the success rate in getting those declared fit actually back into work has only been 13%.
Discontent with the system manifested itself last week in a series protests by disability groups, including a 5000-person march in London, and smaller demonstrations in Edinburgh and Glasgow.
Among those protesting were Black Triangle, a Scottish disability rights group, which on Wednesday delivered a letter to the British Medical Association Scotland’s chair, Brian Keighley, asking doctors to condemn the welfare reform as “unjust and profoundly damaging the patient-doctor relationship”.
The BMA has not replied, but a spokesperson said: “The BMA does have concerns that the assessments appear to be very much process-driven and not always able to assess the claimant in a holistic way.”
While it has already been recognised that the system is not perfect, and a rolling review by Professor Malcolm Harrington is already making changes, many groups say these tweaks are not enough. The Labour MP for Rutherglen and Hamilton West, Tom Greatrex, said: “We need to stop, reassess it, get it right. It’s grossly inefficient for the Government as well to have this many appeals going to tribunal.”
Charities and organisations including the Scottish Association for Mental Health, Scope, and Macmillan Cancer Support in Scotland have spoken out against the system.
Dr Robert Moffat of the National Autistic Society Scotland said: “It is clear from the people with autism we speak to that the current system of Work Capability Assessment (WCA) fails to understand the unique challenges faced by people with a hidden disability. It fails to recognise the unique obstacles people with autism face.”
Several of those who spoke out said some degree of welfare reform was necessary. Greatrex said: “I’ve seen people who have been on incapacity for a long time who’ve managed with various different sorts of help – not through this system – to get back to work. So I can see the benefit, not just financially, but in terms of wellbeing. I do feel the idea was right, but the way it has been structured means that it isn’t doing what it’s supposed to do.”



It then gives 6 personal stories covering a variety illnesses/disabilities and their experiences of dealing with this new system.
If you cannot accept the reality of what's going on then ignore it but don't put your head up and make stupid comments as it "misleading" people as it is some sort of propaganda put out by benefit scrounging sicko's and their sympathisers.
If I am short on tact and diplomacy then it is because I see nothing but derision and disbelief, or dare I say hate being dished out constantly in the media and in these forums against sick and disabled people.
Trying to play around with words like sickness and disability as it relates to ESA is meaningless as it is paid to both definitions whether it be temporary or permanent.

cit_k

9 months wait for a reversal of the decision by appeal, thats nothing, last reversal i had took around TWO YEARS.

Cpt.Scarlet

sunnyone wrote: »

Its a misleading article, ESA is a sickness benefit and not a disability benefit.

As we are being picky.

First the article never refers to ESA as a disability benefit, and secondly, ESA is actually an incapacity benefit, where the incapacity can be the result of illness, injury, or a physical or mental disablement.

sunnyone

MONEYPENNY wrote: »

I shall try once more , sunnyone said the article was misleading, I have read through the article 4 times and is entitled " The War Against The Disabled" and it is not, repeat not misleading

The war against the disabled


A DAMNING report has condemned the new system of disabled benefits assessments for throwing the most vulnerable people in the country into a state of “financial worry and stress”.
The scathing report from Citizens Advice Scotland (CAS), which has now been lodged with the Work and Pensions Committee of the House of Commons, says some disabled people are having to wait up to nine months to appeal decisions to strip them of cash.
Disabled rights organisation, charities, pressure groups and politicians have also rallied together to condemn the “chaos” that the new system of is causing.
Figures have also come to light showing 120 people each day successfully appeal against rulings that they are fit to work.
The Government has hired French company Atos to assess if disabled people claiming incapacity benefit and employment support allowance are entitled to payments or fit for work.
Assessments are finding roughly 40% of claimants fit for work. Some 1.9 million disabled people are due to be assessed in the next three years. From this week onwards the system will accelerate to assess a total of 11,000 people a week.
The CAS report shows the system of welfare reform is leading to a huge bottleneck of appeals and a delay in cases reaching tribunal of around six to nine months. CAS says this is “causing considerable financial worry and stress to claimants”.
Dr Eilidh Whiteford, SNP Work and Pensions spokesperson, said: “The system as it currently stands is obviously flawed and must be reviewed immediately to ensure that those genuinely unable to work are not faced with the stress and financial instability of unnecessary assessment.”
Whiteford, MP for Banff and Buchan in Aberdeenshire, the area in which the current system to tackle incapacity benefit was piloted, also added: “I know from cases in my own constituency of people being wrongly assessed, and whose conditions are actually being exacerbated by the process. While welfare reform is of course necessary, we should not forget that we are dealing with the lives of some of the most vulnerable people in our society.”
CAS says around 70% of its time is spent dealing with employment support allowance claims and appeals. Sunday Herald research has found many people are locked in a seemingly endless cycle of assessment and appeal, in which they are found fit to work, appeal the decision successfully, but then are quickly assessed again by ATOS as fit again. Meanwhile, the actual financial cost of the tribunals, which for the period between October 2008 and June 2009 was £11 million, is estimated to be now something closer to £50m.

The CAS report also points out that the success rate in getting those declared fit actually back into work has only been 13%.
Discontent with the system manifested itself last week in a series protests by disability groups, including a 5000-person march in London, and smaller demonstrations in Edinburgh and Glasgow.
Among those protesting were Black Triangle, a Scottish disability rights group, which on Wednesday delivered a letter to the British Medical Association Scotland’s chair, Brian Keighley, asking doctors to condemn the welfare reform as “unjust and profoundly damaging the patient-doctor relationship”.
The BMA has not replied, but a spokesperson said: “The BMA does have concerns that the assessments appear to be very much process-driven and not always able to assess the claimant in a holistic way.”
While it has already been recognised that the system is not perfect, and a rolling review by Professor Malcolm Harrington is already making changes, many groups say these tweaks are not enough. The Labour MP for Rutherglen and Hamilton West, Tom Greatrex, said: “We need to stop, reassess it, get it right. It’s grossly inefficient for the Government as well to have this many appeals going to tribunal.”
Charities and organisations including the Scottish Association for Mental Health, Scope, and Macmillan Cancer Support in Scotland have spoken out against the system.
Dr Robert Moffat of the National Autistic Society Scotland said: “It is clear from the people with autism we speak to that the current system of Work Capability Assessment (WCA) fails to understand the unique challenges faced by people with a hidden disability. It fails to recognise the unique obstacles people with autism face.”
Several of those who spoke out said some degree of welfare reform was necessary. Greatrex said: “I’ve seen people who have been on incapacity for a long time who’ve managed with various different sorts of help – not through this system – to get back to work. So I can see the benefit, not just financially, but in terms of wellbeing. I do feel the idea was right, but the way it has been structured means that it isn’t doing what it’s supposed to do.”



It then gives 6 personal stories covering a variety illnesses/disabilities and their experiences of dealing with this new system.
If you cannot accept the reality of what's going on then ignore it but don't put your head up and make stupid comments as it "misleading" people as it is some sort of propaganda put out by benefit scrounging sicko's and their sympathisers.
If I am short on tact and diplomacy then it is because I see nothing but derision and disbelief, or dare I say hate being dished out constantly in the media and in these forums against sick and disabled people.
Trying to play around with words like sickness and disability as it relates to ESA is meaningless as it is paid to both definitions whether it be temporary or permanent.

Cpt.Scarlet wrote: »

As we are being picky.

First the article never refers to ESA as a disability benefit, and secondly, ESA is actually an incapacity benefit, where the incapacity can be the result of illness, injury, or a physical or mental disablement.

Read the red bit, it is refering to IB and ESA and throughout the article and it says that disabled people are claiming these benefits without mentioning ill people which is wrong because its a sickness benefit only and you can be disabled and work and be ill but not disabled.

Emotive langauge dosnt help fight the injustice of people wrongly refused any benefit to which they are entitled.

Cpt.Scarlet

sunnyone wrote: »

Read the red bit, it is refering to IB and ESA and throughout the article and it says that disabled people are claiming these benefits without mentioning ill people which is wrong because its a sickness benefit only and you can be disabled and work and be ill but not disabled.

Emotive langauge dosnt help fight the injustice of people wrongly refused any benefit to which they are entitled.

You seem to think that the circimstances you describe are mutually exclusive, they are not.

ESA is not a sickness benefit only, it is an incapacity benefit. If you are unable to work because of illness, injury, or a physical or mental disability you are entitled to claim ESA.

The DWP is an equal opportunity depriver of benefit, they will happily deny ESA to someone who is diabled as someone who is ill.

Cpt.Scarlet

eddy51 wrote: »

Any advice please?

Yes, start a new thread rather tacking your question onto one that hasn't been updated in 18 months.

There's a NEW THREAD button at both top and bottom of the thread list.