Is there any burden of proof on the police?

mikey72

Lum wrote: »

One thing that really bothers me..

In a civil case, a passenger in your car is not accepted as a witness, even if it's a hitchhiker who you have never met before in your life.

In a criminal case, which is supposedly held to a higher standard of evidence, two coppers in the same car. Two colleagues who work together daily, count as corroborating evidence.

How the hell do they explain that?

Whether you like it or not, society expects and believes that a policeman is an honest citizen, and will uphold the law.

shaun_from_Africa

Whether you like it or not, society expects and believes that a policeman is an honest citizen, and will uphold the law.

But surely the government also believes that citizens in general are honest and will uphold the law, which is why there is normally a presumption of innocence and the onus is on the prosecution to prove guilt.

Flyboy152

Sessie wrote: »

My husband was stopped last week by an officer who insisted my husband was not wearing his seatbelt in his works van.

My husband insists he was and I have to say in all the years I've known him I have NEVER known him not to wear one. I work in a company which deals with accident claims and often talk about my work so he knows what happens to people who don't and also he knows that it would contravene his employer's insurance if he were to have an accident in the works vehicle and not be wearing it - is he really going to risk his job just to not wear a seabelt?

I must stress that if in ANY way I thought my husband wasn't wearing one I would be saying, "tough luck sonny, you were caught, pay up" but I don't think that is the case.

The ticket we have gives two options : pay up or go to Court - SURELY this can't be right? Don't we have the right to appeal? It can't just be, "well the officer says you did so you did". Is there no burden of proof on the officer to PROVE his accusation? If not, then surely they could go around willy nilly passing out these tickets and the general public would have no redress?

Finally, I am not for one minute suggesting that this officer nor any other officer are anything other than professional - I am merely stating that he has made a mistake. Everyone makes mistakes, but if there is no way to SAY this and challenge them then where is the justice they fight so hard to uphold?

Anyone who has any genuine knowledge, I'd appreciate a reply as I would like to appeal/write/whatever as quickly as possible.

Thank you in advance.

x

If you have legal cover on your insurance; use it.

societys_child

I see quite a few don't believe that police would make something up.
A friend (traffic cop) told me he was always in trouble for not ticketing enough drivers. So what he did was book people for fixed penalty, non-endorseable things, like no seat belt, using a bus lane etc. As far as I know he never invented anything but he had to get his quota up. He said there were many things that he would have ignored or "just had a word" about but he had to write some tickets.
He also said he usually went for trucks or firms vans because the company often pay the fines for their drivers.
So, afaik my mate never made anything up but I can see that some might if they needed to fill their quota for the day . . .

Just one of many experiences:
Many years ago, driving a large box van on a country road, I passed a cop car in a farm gateway who pulled out and followed me, got right up my !!!!, must have thought I didn't know he was there!
I was doing nothing wrong, 40 MPH, then we entered a 30 limit and I'd obviously slowed to less than 30. He followed me for another half mile, then pulled me. Said I was doing 40 in a 30 limit. This was absolute b!!!!!ks, complete fabrication.
My boss said you've no chance in court and paid the fine, I got the 3 points though. (this was pre- tachograph days)

So I can tell you from personal experience(s) some are absolute .. [censored]

NeverAgain_2

...My boss said you've no chance in court and paid the fine...

You never know what the magistrates know.

Had you challenged it, they might have thought: "Here's another one where it's just the word of PC Savage against a driver who is credible, and certain he's innocent.
"Perhaps there is a rabbit away."

Sessie

In a VERY interesting twist we have today received a letter from the Police advising us that...

"...due to an administrative error the Issuing Officer is withdrawing the ticket issued on 01/05/2011. If you have already paid the fine arrangements will be made to re-imburse you.

We apologise for any inconvenience caused..."

Hmmm... wonder if he had checked whether we had paid, found out we hadn't and had second thoughts?! We have checked the ticket really carefully and every section is completed correctly.

"..administrative error..." eh??

Still, all's well that ends well and we don't have to pay anything.:T

atrixblue.-MFR-.

Sessie wrote: »

In a VERY interesting twist we have today received a letter from the Police advising us that...

"...due to an administrative error the Issuing Officer is withdrawing the ticket issued on 01/05/2011. If you have already paid the fine arrangements will be made to re-imburse you.

We apologise for any inconvenience caused..."

Hmmm... wonder if he had checked whether we had paid, found out we hadn't and had second thoughts?! We have checked the ticket really carefully and every section is completed correctly.

"..administrative error..." eh??

Still, all's well that ends well and we don't have to pay anything.:T

??? may not may yet.

NeverAgain_2

...May, not May yet...

Perhaps that was the administrative error.

AnythingButChardonnay

This happened to a relative of mine. He paid the fine, £30, and thought nothing of it.

Several months down the line he got a letter saying they were cancelling it and who to make the cheque payable to.

The fine had since doubled to £60, but alas the cheque was only for £30!

I wonder why they change their mind on it, for seat belt offences in particular?

Flyboy152

Sessie wrote: »

In a VERY interesting twist we have today received a letter from the Police advising us that...

"...due to an administrative error the Issuing Officer is withdrawing the ticket issued on 01/05/2011. If you have already paid the fine arrangements will be made to re-imburse you.

We apologise for any inconvenience caused..."

Hmmm... wonder if he had checked whether we had paid, found out we hadn't and had second thoughts?! We have checked the ticket really carefully and every section is completed correctly.

"..administrative error..." eh??

Still, all's well that ends well and we don't have to pay anything.:T

Many moons ago, I was fined for making an illegal right turn, at a junction that had always allowed a right turn for years. About a year later, we got a letter from the Chief Constable saying that we had been fined in error, because there was no license issued for the no right turn.