£8000 unexpected underpayment of tax due to a catalogue of errors with tax office and

patanne

I'm not too surprised at that with the aggression the op received from some of the other posters on here.

chrismac1

If we are going to help you you must post up the figures. As my earlier post has made clear, it is not all that unsual for silly errors to double up - or more than double - the size of one of these bills. So please dig out the information and we can check it out for you. If it's right you will in the end have to pay. My guess is that there is a 50-50 chance it contains something daft, so at the very least you can reduce the size of it.

Buster1874

I'm in a similiar situation, just got a set of tax calculations for the last three years showing that I have undrpaid tax on an occupational pension that I receive as well as my salary, to the tune of over £10k. How on earth can HMRC not realise that is happening and allow huge amounts to build up over 3 years? I'm !!!!!!ed if I know how I am going to pay it back. (and probably like most people on here, I'm no accountant and put my faith, misguidedly, in those I hope will sort it...employers, pension providers etc.) Nor have I seen a tax return in the last few years. Can't remember when I last had one.

Pennywise

patanne wrote: »

All this tax mess goes to prove the necessity for financial education in schools. Maybe the next step should be compulsory seminars every 10 years for all adults!!! With a special one for people approaching retirement as the taxing of pensions seems to be a major problem area for the unwary/unaware.

No, it goes to prove that HMRC need a kick up the backside to do their job properly. The system worked perfectly well up until a few years ago. Every Autumn, HMRC "reconciled" their records and would issue demands or repayments and change the codings etc so that it would be right for the following year.

Also, until a few years ago, you could actually communicate with the tax authorities - phone calls were answered by your local office who had your file, letters were actually opened, read and dealt with promptly. Now, people just give up trying to communicate when they're left on hold for 30 minutes or more or the system cuts them off - something like 40% of HMRC incoming calls aren't even answered! Letters never get dealt with - there seems a black hole within HMRC (some would say they just get binned when a person's in-tray becomes too high!).

To look at things in a different way, if we were all educated in tax matters, and were made responsible for ourselves, then what is the purpose of HMRC? Couldn't we do away with them completely for the average Joe Public and just have a substantially slimmed down body that just does investigation work for those who are deliberately non-compliant - completely ignoring the majority who were compliant? That would take away the need to file returns etc - all people would have to do is send payment - is that really want you want to happen?

I have clients who are dealt with by tax offices in other european countries and the common factor is how quick and efficient they are. For example, a Jersey client received annual tax bill/reconciliation within 3 weeks of their tax year end - that was all done by the Jersey tax office, no self assessment - they just processed the employer's returns as soon as they were received. What was more striking is that the tax bill/reconciliation came with a personalised covering letter which explained in clear English what it meant, how the tax became underpaid, etc - compare that with the nonsensical letters and demands churned out by HMRC which often go into excrutiating detail about things that don't matter and barely mention the important facts.

John_Pierpoint

In the glory "mohair suit" days of IT, there was a raft of shift workers who had the job of putting up the tapes, changing the discs on the disc drives, stripping the carbon paper out of the multi part print outs. Any one who knew how to follow a recipe in a domestic kitchen could have done the job with a minimum of training.
These shift work operators were in the right place at the right time and by working overtime and double time for Sunday etc.etc. they could take home a small fortune in salary and expenses.

Another good example, that made the front page of the red tops, was "an assistant" on a film crew. The union had negotiated a deal where the employee's rate of pay doubled every the employee did not get 12 hours off between shifts. This astute young woman/dogsbody came back from an overseas assignment to a salary payment that looked more like a lottery win.

When this sort of thing happens in a moderate sized team there is usually one member who is sharp enough to explain all the tax and NI implications to his work mates and check the calculations for them.

If you are a one man band, commuting & working 80+ hours a week, you just don't make time to get a round tuit.

John.

Moneymaking tip: If you want to earn a lot of money for a not terribly skilled job and are prepared to work long hours; get in on a task where there is a lot of capital already invested, with a big payout in the offing.
What you get paid is immaterial in the great sum of things.
The "laggers" in a power station, who finish the job off just before commissioning, know this.

Is it just possible that this country needs its tax system simplified to no longer be the world's most complex?

family_man

John_Pierpoint wrote: »

In the glory "mohair suit" days of IT, there was a raft of shift workers who had the job of putting up the tapes, changing the discs on the disc drives, stripping the carbon paper out of the multi part print outs. Any one who knew how to follow a recipe in a domestic kitchen could have done the job with a minimum of training.
These shift work operators were in the right place at the right time and by working overtime and double time for Sunday etc.etc. they could take home a small fortune in salary and expenses.

Another good example, that made the front page of the red tops, was "an assistant" on a film crew. The union had negotiated a deal where the employee's rate of pay doubled every the employee did not get 12 hours off between shifts. This astute young woman/dogsbody came back from an overseas assignment to a salary payment that looked more like a lottery win.

When this sort of thing happens in a moderate sized team there is usually one member who is sharp enough to explain all the tax and NI implications to his work mates and check the calculations for them.

If you are a one man band, commuting & working 80+ hours a week, you just don't make time to get a round tuit.

John.

Moneymaking tip: If you want to earn a lot of money for a not terribly skilled job and are prepared to work long hours; get in on a task where there is a lot of capital already invested, with a big payout in the offing.
What you get paid is immaterial in the great sum of things.
The "laggers" in a power station, who finish the job off just before commissioning, know this.

Is it just possible that this country needs its tax system simplified to no longer be the world's most complex?

That is exactly right John,

and for the ones who have the attitude on here you need to take your blinkers off and get out there. There is plenty of money out there if you are prepared to work very long hours and hard for it.

If my employer had processed my P45 or failing that followed up with a P46, or if the tax office had informed me a year ago when they should have done I wouldn’t be in this mess. I have never had any need to check as past employers have always had competent people to handle my salary deductions.

I didn’t even have the luxury to cross check with other employees as they enforce a policy where you are not obliged to discuss your salary with others.

jem16

family_man wrote: »

There is plenty of money out there if you are prepared to work very long hours and hard for it.

What if we don't want to work very long hours and actually have a family life?

If my employer had processed my P45 or failing that followed up with a P46, or if the tax office had informed me a year ago when they should have done I wouldn’t be in this mess. I have never had any need to check as past employers have always had competent people to handle my salary deductions.

Family_man please stop sticking your head in the sand, doing nothing about this current situation and trying to blame everyone else but yourself. Yes HMRC are in a bit of a mess at the moment and things shouldn't be happening that are happening. However if you had taken a couple of minutes to look over your tax affiars from the start you should have realised that BR is not a normal tax code for someone with only one job and one one income. Everyone should really do this when starting a new job and is not a difficutl task.

People here are trying to help you to see if HMRC have made a mistake in their calculations and possibly don't owe as much as they have asked you for. However without those figures requested no-one can help and you seem to be ignoring this.

If you would prefer not to publish the figures on the forum then send me a pm with the figures and I'll look over them for you and at least tell you whether or not the calculations are correct.

le_loup

jem, you are a nice person and some people do not deserve your time and consideration. On behalf of the people you have assisted in the past, many thanks.

family_man

jem16 wrote: »

What if we don't want to work very long hours and actually have a family life?



Family_man please stop sticking your head in the sand, doing nothing about this current situation and trying to blame everyone else but yourself. Yes HMRC are in a bit of a mess at the moment and things shouldn't be happening that are happening. However if you had taken a couple of minutes to look over your tax affiars from the start you should have realised that BR is not a normal tax code for someone with only one job and one one income. Everyone should really do this when starting a new job and is not a difficutl task.

People here are trying to help you to see if HMRC have made a mistake in their calculations and possibly don't owe as much as they have asked you for. However without those figures requested no-one can help and you seem to be ignoring this.

If you would prefer not to publish the figures on the forum then send me a pm with the figures and I'll look over them for you and at least tell you whether or not the calculations are correct.

Thanks for trying to assist with figures I am not disputing that I appreciate it, it’s just the way that everything has happened. In all my years of working in multiple jobs (too many to list) and most of on low salary’s nothing has ever happened like this.

jem16

family_man wrote: »

Thanks for trying to assist with figures I am not disputing that

If as you say you do not know much about tax how can you be sure it's correct and not dispute it?

family_man wrote: »

We are not talking a few hundred pounds but almost £8000, its scandalous. I am running out of options and any help would be greatly appreciated.

So what kind of help were you looking for?